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Post by jaq515 on Aug 19, 2011 11:57:00 GMT -5
And if they were really working together on this Noel should have been piping up around the BDI release and getting them headlines. i think we can agree that Noel's Album is basically an Oasis release. The Cd singles, the high budget video's , special edition albums, making of DVD etc etc. Beady eye was done on the cheap, I'm sure Liam even said that it was done on the cheap to test the water to to see if people wanted to hear them. Obviously they are pushing the marketing harder for Noel's album
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Aug 19, 2011 12:10:42 GMT -5
"Really? I thought this happened all the time in America? But they call it 'Defamation of character'? Didn't Eminem's mum sue him for this sort of thing? He jokingly claimed she "smoked more dope than I do" in a song or something and she sued him for about $10 million! So it does happen there. Liam isn't even suing Noel, he's just asking for a statement retraction. Which would be perfectly acceptable had a journalist said what Noel had said in an article, happens ALL the time. Noel himself has taken legal action to make journalists write retractions on false claims, so why is it any different that Liam is doing the same thing to Noel? It's fair enough I think." A rational human being would just let it go. Nobody gives a flying shit whether he had: (A) laryngitis after staying in bed and reading the Bible the night before (B) laryngitis and a hangover after smoking twleve packs of Camels and gargling Jack Daniels all night (C) a hangover with his voice as pure as the day he recorded Cast No Shadow Yes, there are frivilous lawsuits filed in the US (and canada) every day. Gotta tell, you, as a lawyer, it is fucking annoying see trials delayed for months because the courts are bound up with garbage like this. Liam obviously gives a shit. Its not about what you or I think though is it? Why do so many people on here assume that the Gallaghers are trying to satify the public or the fans. It would seem Liam is doing this because Liam is upset about it and if his brother is lying then good luck to him because no one would be happy seeing someone say that to the assembled press if it wasn't true.
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retrolego
Oasis Roadie
Walking to the sound of my favorite tune
Posts: 277
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Post by retrolego on Aug 19, 2011 12:13:12 GMT -5
Some people are taking this far too seriously for what it is, looking into English law and all that bollocks. Thought you Americans were used to all this 'suing' nonsense. I find the whole thing quite bemusing but quite enjoy seeing the gallaghers being front page news as it can only help sales for the two of them. Nuff said!
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Post by oneeye on Aug 19, 2011 12:17:13 GMT -5
The bottom line is ... if Liam proves that Noel is lying, Noel's reputation with the public and press is going down hill.
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Post by gdforever on Aug 19, 2011 12:17:31 GMT -5
And if they were really working together on this Noel should have been piping up around the BDI release and getting them headlines. i think we can agree that Noel's Album is basically an Oasis release. The Cd singles, the high budget video's , special edition albums, making of DVD etc etc. Beady eye was done on the cheap, I'm sure Liam even said that it was done on the cheap to test the water to to see if people wanted to hear them. Obviously they are pushing the marketing harder for Noel's album Yeah...I can totally imagine Liam agreeing to that. We're both gonna be putting out an album...but I'm alright with doing my promo on the cheap because we all know that everyone is really waiting for Noel's album and we really just want to test the waters. Sue Noel even though half the world already believed that I dropped the ball because of hard living the night before and drag that all up again? Sure anything to help Noel chart well! I think Noel is getting a bigger release because he is insisting on it being done properly. He has been involved in the the planning and implementation of the promo of Oasis album's all of which were high-profile releases. Of course his promo is more polished. Liam hardly did any promo in Oasis and the last time Andy and Gem were really involved would have been back when they were in their smallish respective indie bands. Plus he is signed to a bigger label in America than BDI so that probably has a lot to do with the quality of his videos etc.
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Post by gdforever on Aug 19, 2011 12:24:32 GMT -5
The bottom line is ... if Liam proves that Noel is lying, Noel's reputation with the public and press is going down hill. He doesn't have to prove that Noel was lying. But Noel just has to prove that he had reasonable ground to believe what he said. Unfortunately for Liam that won't be hard The fact is that that was a popular theory around the V-festival cancellation. Liam went out to a football match hooted, hollared, smoked, and drank. Good luck to Liam defending himself against that. Liam won't be able to win this for losing. Frankly, Noel Gallagher is way to press savvy to get bogged down by this. Noel is gonna walk out of this smelling like roses and he isn't even gonna need to do much. Noel Gallagher daring to besmirch the impeccable professional reputation of Liam Gallagher? How will anyone ever take Noel seriously again! As if!
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Post by jeffrey on Aug 19, 2011 12:34:35 GMT -5
lmao this is hilariously ridiculous. i lol'd @ Souldigger's ballwashers comment. Seriously WTF Liam!? how could he win this thing anyways? it's a matter of he said- he said. I guess the rest of the band could testify? i think i've watched too many Law&Order episodes hehe... Just give him a call and end this nonsense. I'm a prosecutor and this lawsuit (if it is, in fact, true) IS one Liam could win. Noel held a press conference and publically commented on something that could be perceived as defamation. If Liam actually had laryngitis and can prove it, he could most likely win in claims court.
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Post by jaq515 on Aug 19, 2011 12:35:35 GMT -5
why would Liam wait until 4 days before Noels single to issue this writ? Im pretty sure the lawyers / law firms the gallaghers deal with this could've been served much faster.
We know the sun / gordon smart loves noel. This week noels had lots of publcity with the sun. So why would Liam choose the sun to issue his statement?
No body looks good from this situation both liam and noel look foolish. There are no winners except publicity.
this won't go to court, so all the legal reasoning is completly pointless, nearly all case like this get settled out of court.
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Post by gdforever on Aug 19, 2011 12:36:37 GMT -5
lmao this is hilariously ridiculous. i lol'd @ Souldigger's ballwashers comment. Seriously WTF Liam!? how could he win this thing anyways? it's a matter of he said- he said. I guess the rest of the band could testify? i think i've watched too many Law&Order episodes hehe... Just give him a call and end this nonsense. I'm a prosecutor and this lawsuit (if it is, in fact, true) IS one Liam could win. Noel held a press conference and publically commented on something that could be perceived as defamation. If Liam actually had laryngitis and can prove it, he could most likely win in claims court. But does Liam no also need to prove reckless disregard for the truth? Did Noel have reasonable cause to claim as he did? I think he probably does. Liam was out drinking the night before.
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Post by gdforever on Aug 19, 2011 12:39:17 GMT -5
why would Liam wait until 4 days before Noels single to issue this writ? Im pretty sure the lawyers / law firms the gallaghers deal with this could've been served much faster. We know the sun / gordon smart loves noel. This week noels had lots of publcity with the sun. So why would Liam choose the sun to issue his statement? No body looks good from this situation both liam and noel look foolish. There are no winners except publicity. this won't go to court, so all the legal reasoning is completly pointless, nearly all case like this get settled out of court. Liam's lawyers apparently set Noel a written request for an apology which Noel ignored. It could just be that they said that if they didn't get a response within 3 weeks they'd file a suit. The single release may just be coincidental.
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Post by jaq515 on Aug 19, 2011 12:43:56 GMT -5
why would Liam wait until 4 days before Noels single to issue this writ? Im pretty sure the lawyers / law firms the gallaghers deal with this could've been served much faster. We know the sun / gordon smart loves noel. This week noels had lots of publcity with the sun. So why would Liam choose the sun to issue his statement? No body looks good from this situation both liam and noel look foolish. There are no winners except publicity. this won't go to court, so all the legal reasoning is completly pointless, nearly all case like this get settled out of court. Liam's lawyers apparently set Noel a written request for an apology which Noel ignored. It could just be that they said that if they didn't get a response within 3 weeks they'd file a suit. The single release may just be coincidental. It may well be but the amount of people who picked up the sun today via the gallagher headlines. Then they find a 2 page special with noel promoting his album / single is possibly one the best coincidence ever liam couldve issued his statement to any paper, he would've known noel had a 2 page special inside.. surely liam would've choose another paper
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Post by bonkers on Aug 19, 2011 12:44:27 GMT -5
people at the time were saying Liam was hungover, a lot of the bands backstage thought they were breaking up there and then
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Post by TheShakermaker on Aug 19, 2011 12:47:19 GMT -5
I think this is being analyzed too much.
Until the press conference, Noel was silent about everything. Liam seemed to try to prove himself as a serious musician, and whatever he said about Noel was relatively innocent. Then Noel breaks his silence, and Liam is made a fool of, and his reputation as being a serious part of beady eye is challenged.
I can see why Liam would do this. It must be annoying to not be taken seriously, whenever Noel decides to say something to get some publicity. We don't know if Liam tried, through Gem or his mom to have Noel stop all these comments, but i would think so.
I'll admit that i've always leaned to Noel's side, but i believe that he was as big a part of the split as Liam, and i think he should have either shown more respect towards beady eye in his comment, or kept his mouth shut. He's been pretty clever in badmouthing them, without saying it directly. Noel's too proud to apologise, but i think he'll lose this one, and entirely his own fault. Let beady eye do their music, and Noel his, and then that should decide it.
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Post by jeffrey on Aug 19, 2011 12:47:43 GMT -5
I'm a prosecutor and this lawsuit (if it is, in fact, true) IS one Liam could win. Noel held a press conference and publically commented on something that could be perceived as defamation. If Liam actually had laryngitis and can prove it, he could most likely win in claims court. But does Liam no also need to prove reckless disregard for the truth? Did Noel have reasonable cause to claim as he did? I think he probably does. Liam was out drinking the night before. Liam has a lot of "reckless" public comments he can use against Noel. I.e.: Noel's departure statement from Oasis (being physically and emotionally bullied) and numerous other defamatory comments that could be used as showing a pattern of libel. And, it doesn't matter one bit if Liam was drinking the night prior. If he has a physician's diagnosis, it is probable that he'd win. Disclaimer: All of this is based on my knowledge and practice of Texas law. However, libel, is a pretty universal definition and is commonly pursued and founded in Western cultures
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Post by ctmazin on Aug 19, 2011 12:48:28 GMT -5
"Liam obviously gives a shit. Its not about what you or I think though is it? Why do so many people on here assume that the Gallaghers are trying to satify the public or the fans. It would seem Liam is doing this because Liam is upset about it and if his brother is lying then good luck to him because no one would be happy seeing someone say that to the assembled press if it wasn't true."
Yes, and I am criticizing Liam for giving a shit. Because no one else gives a shit at this point.
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Post by ctmazin on Aug 19, 2011 12:57:30 GMT -5
"(being physically and emotionally bullied) and numerous other defamatory comments that could be used as showing a pattern of libel."
Are you kidding me. You think that Noel saying he was physically and emotionally bullied is DEFAMATORY? Given the shit that has flown back and forth between these two, do you not think that Noel could easily prove that he felt physical and verbal intimidation. As could Liam vice versa.
It does matter if Liam was out drinking the night before. Every detail matters in a case like this, as it depends heavily on perception.
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Post by gdforever on Aug 19, 2011 13:00:54 GMT -5
But does Liam no also need to prove reckless disregard for the truth? Did Noel have reasonable cause to claim as he did? I think he probably does. Liam was out drinking the night before. Liam has a lot of "reckless" public comments he can use against Noel. I.e.: Noel's departure statement from Oasis (being physically and emotionally bullied) and numerous other defamatory comments that could be used as showing a pattern of libel. And, it doesn't matter one bit if Liam was drinking the night prior. If he has a physician's diagnosis, it is probable that he'd win. Disclaimer: All of this is based on my knowledge and practice of Texas law. However, libel, is a pretty universal definition and is commonly pursued and founded in Western cultures I really don't think that is right. To prove libel you have to prove that the person knew that it wasn't the truth when he said it. In English law, as someone already pointed out, the statement by Noel is assumed to be false unless Noel proves it to be true. The opposite of American law. In English court, Liam has to prove that Noel knew it wasn't true and said it knowing that it was untrue to harm or slander Liam. An acceptable defence in both the UK and the US includes the defense of fair comment on a matter of public interest, Which means if a reasonable person could honestly entertain such an opinion, the statement is protected. If Noel has a good lawyer, which he will, Liam will have a hard time claiming that Noel knew that Liam was not hungover and maliciously slandered him. They fact that Liam let all the articles with claims to the same effect pass without incident 2 years ago might count against him. He is suing only because it's his brother? Why didn't he sue the several press outlets that made the same claim? The fact is that they have been slamming eachother back and forth for so long to go to court @ this point is stupid and a waste of everyones time and money. Liam should have just put out his own statement or released the doctors note to the press. It'll all end up coming down to the judge presiding though. It could go either way IMO.
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Aug 19, 2011 13:01:39 GMT -5
hahaha you are criticizing Liam for being upset about it? Because he should really consider how much you and others care about it. From the amount of posts you've made in this thread i'd say you give a shit.
*Not aimed at you GD.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2011 13:02:46 GMT -5
A lot of libel/slander/defamation cases are heard under UK jurisdiction because it errs on the side of those that claim injury. The fact that the comments at Noel's press conference have been edited out of the version of his website would seem to suggest that they were potentially dangerous legally, either as a basis for a slander charge from Liam or as a breach of contract with V Festival. The doctor's note is reall the be-all and end all to it. If Liam was 'signed off sick' and the doctor hasn't changed his opinion that's it black and white really.
My question about the whole thing revolves around both parties still having the same management - it's surely a recipe for disaster that at one point there'll be a conflict of interest claimed?
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Post by ctmazin on Aug 19, 2011 13:05:43 GMT -5
I am upset because frivilous legal garbage is a pet peeve of mine given my line of work. I see way too much of this sort of crap. Too many people use the court system as a weapon to salve their hurt feelings.
Where there is no definable injury or damage (as in this case), just fucking let it go!
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Post by TheShakermaker on Aug 19, 2011 13:06:57 GMT -5
The fact is that they have been slamming eachother back and forth for so long to go to court @ this point is stupid and a waste of everyones time and money. Liam should have just put out his own statement or released the doctors note to the press. This is spot on
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Post by jeffrey on Aug 19, 2011 13:08:22 GMT -5
"(being physically and emotionally bullied) and numerous other defamatory comments that could be used as showing a pattern of libel." Are you kidding me. You think that Noel saying he was physically and emotionally bullied is DEFAMATORY? Given the shit that has flown back and forth between these two, do you not think that Noel could easily prove that he felt physical and verbal intimidation. As could Liam vice versa. It does matter if Liam was out drinking the night before. Every detail matters in a case like this, as it depends heavily on perception. Being able to show a pattern of whatever it is someone is suing for is paramount. Therefore, Liam could and with any DECENT attorney's advice would use such statements. And yes, those comments were defamatory. Noel blamed everything on Liam, the band and management. He never accepted any blame and used words that could be perceived as humiliating. Once more, IT DOES NOT MATTER if Liam was drinking the night prior, as long as he has a physician's diagnosis. I'm not going to argue law with anyone; I am familiar with Texas law. I can't issue s statement with utter certainty about English Law, but I do know that, in Texas, Liam would have grounds for a lawsuit. And he would have a better than 50/50 chance at prevailing in said suit.
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Aug 19, 2011 13:08:58 GMT -5
A lot of libel/slander/defamation cases are heard under UK jurisdiction because it errs on the side of those that claim injury. The fact that the comments at Noel's press conference have been edited out of the version of his website would seem to suggest that they were potentially dangerous legally, either as a basis for a slander charge from Liam or as a breach of contract with V Festival. The doctor's note is reall the be-all and end all to it. If Liam was 'signed off sick' and the doctor hasn't changed his opinion that's it black and white really. My question about the whole thing revolves around both parties still having the same management - it's surely a recipe for disaster that at one point there'll be a conflict of interest claimed? You sound like a professional?
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Post by J.B on Aug 19, 2011 13:09:08 GMT -5
Why are people being annoying c*nts and putting their little lawyer hats on and pretending they know anything about legal stuff.
Have a sit down, breathe into a plastic bag, count to ten and get on with your lives.
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Post by Nyron Nosworthy on Aug 19, 2011 13:12:54 GMT -5
No, I'd imagine it would be "Liam pulled out because he had a hangover" which is libellous. Saying they had an argument over Pretty Green isn't. LOL you still think someone can win a lawsuit based on that? Of course he can win, jesus fucking wept. I have no idea why you keep quoting American libel laws. Not that it will ever get to the stage of "Liam wins" or "Noel wins." Libel cases are almost always settled out of court as it is impossible to prove the extent of damages. It isn't something that can be quantified. Noel stated that Liam cancelled because he was hungover. Liam claims to have been medically assessed and diagnosed with laryngitis. Debate all you like whether he is ethically right to take action, but legally he is 100% within his rights if this is the case. Not sure what planet some of you are on if you think that it ISN'T damaging - Noel is insinuating that Liam breached his contract and lacked professionalism. In my opinion, Noel and Liam can slag each other off all they like, but Noel has crossed a line if he is making unsubstantiated claims.
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