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Post by andrewmattcoles on Jul 19, 2016 13:53:45 GMT -5
Apparently the reissue will be announced the day before Noel's last gig at Brixton. To which, rather than doing the right thing and playing something from it..he will instead ignore BHN completely
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Post by guigsysEstring on Jul 19, 2016 14:00:27 GMT -5
I think Noel owns the right of Oasis records now, he signed a publishing deal with Sony years ago. All reissues are under Big Brother Recordings Ltd. So yeah, he makes money out of it. He wouldn't be involved in it otherwise, or just to please the fans, let's be realistic. It doesn't cost much to make so the profit margin is probably interesting. Which doesn't rule out a reunion to back up the reissues or a new album. I'll just leave this good article here... www.techdirt.com/articles/20100712/23482610186.shtmlIn short... if Oasis could sell 250,000 copies of Be Here Now (will never happen with a reissue) at an average price of $15.00 per record... then the average musicians cut is all of $87,750. There is a reason why bands, even the most successful ones, tour relentlessly. I believe guigsysEstring works on the inside as well, and can corroborate the article above. That article is a good description of the traditional record deal where an artist signs directly to a record label, in particular one of the majors. What I would say is the equal split between musicians is a bit general, as many artists where there is more than one individual have different shares to the members. The system did a good job of earning majors substantial profits, with Thorn EMI reporting £539,000,000 pre-tax profits back in 1996, and stating that with the business splitting in two (electrical & music) the music division was responsible for the lion's share of earnings. Meanwhile more recently Sony Music Entertainment reported third quarter earnings that comprised worldwide sales of $1.35BN with operating profits of $210,000,000 for the three months to Dec 31st 2014, so a full year's earnings could potentially still match 1990's earnings despite the 'doom' warnings we have had previously- Music Business Worldwide The article quoted by @kitjenson also does not cover publishing contracts in any depth which I will go into a little later in these ramblings. The Oasis catalogue is on a profit share scheme between Big Brother Recordings Ltd and Sony Music Entertainment which covers all territories and included the back catalogue as well as future releases, including reissues, etc.- Daily Mirror- June 2008 . A quick check at Companies House shows that the Oasis record label has four Directors which are Liam, Noel, Marcus Russell and Alec McKinley, with the latter doubling up as company secretary. These four gentlemen are also the only four shareholders listed, with 300 shares issued being split 120 each to the brothers (40% each) and 30 each to the managers (10% each). Assuming the initial deal with Sony Music Entertainment still stands then the profit share arrangement on the Oasis catalogue will see Big Brother Recordings Ltd receive it's share of the profit after agreed costs, which may not necessarily be 50%, before remitting it's own profits in the form of dividends to the shareholders after deducting any of it's own costs. These initial or later deductible costs I would presume will still include royalty payments to former members for their work on previous recordings, excluding Tony McCarroll who was on a separate contract and who was brought out of future claims as part of his 1999 settlement, and possibly Zak Starkey depending on what his financial arrangements were with the band. EDIT- I would assume Noel and Liam take their royalties along with the two managers taking their commissions as dividends, which would reduce their tax liability by paying a lower earnings limit or zero salary and making up the rest in annual payments. This further increases the amount one can earn net without the need to base yourself offshore, although that didn't stop U2 for example seeking to further limit their tax liabilities in Republic of Ireland by incorporating in territories with more favourable tax rates and systems. In fairness to Bono & Co. their charitable annual donations also contribute to a reduced tax bill as such actions are deductible. I think the problem when people refer to it as 'stealing' and such is that many simply do not understand the laws and I find their comments irritating in all honesty in much the same way as anyone commenting on a subject they clearly do not understand. I would stress I do not include politically minded commentators, including some on here such as theyknowwhatimean and matt as their objections to such arrangements and systems are based on political convictions rather than not understanding the issues or laws. andymorris is correct that Noel has publishing income with Sony Music, although this is separate from Big Brother Recordings Ltd and is collected under his 'Oasis Music' trading name. This is personal rather than a limited company and is for the publishing revenue accrued by his catalogue of songs released with Oasis, which was primarily published with Sony Music Publishing and it's subsidiaries, although Creation Songs Ltd (Alan McGee/Dick Green) also has a share in some titles from the first three albums. The income derived from this will primarily be split between Noel Gallagher and his publishers equally, whilst the other former songwriting members of Oasis will have their own publishing deals. Publishing can be very lucrative on it's own not only with airplay and record sales, but also for monetising the catalogue via advertising, covers, film or television synchronisation, etc. which can generate substantial sums as individual deals. Noel Gallagher will also be deriving a good income from his solo career, with Sour Mash Records Ltd having a similar structure to Big Brother except Noel holds 80% of the shares, with the two managers holding 10% each and all three being the only Directors with Alec once again doubling up as company secretary. Sour Mash Records Ltd will have distribution and licensing deals worldwide that are undoubtedly more favourable than new artists, and possibly even on better terms than Big Brother Records Ltd, so that in itself is a potential goldmine for revenue. The publishing for the solo material is wholly owned by Noel under his 'Dead Leg Music' trading name, so he will receive all publishing royalties due for these songs. In conclusion the Oasis catalogue is a valuable one for the brothers, although I would doubt a vinyl reissue will be a high earner overall, and will continue to earn a good income assuming they can continue to entice new listeners and repackage the catalogue in the coming years. Noel Gallagher meanwhile has the potential to earn a substantial amount above this with his solo career, which if he maintains it at it's current level or higher will continue to generate it's own successful revenue streams. These earnings and structures do not take touring into account, which is usually handled separately by an artist partnership or limited company in association with third party promoters. In Oasis case this is not relevant at this point, but in the event of a reunion I would assume it will be the brothers and their management minus fees for ex-members or salaries for session musicians to do a tour, which would generate tens of millions in ticket sales, merchandise, potential broadcast and follow up DVD releases, etc. as well as potentially boosting the back catalogue sales for Big Brother Recordings Ltd. In Noel's case he will have deals with third party promoters in which the artist share of the aforementioned live music revenue streams will be paid to him, minus management, touring musicians and associated touring costs, which again can generate a substantial income. Hope I haven't bored you all with too much information   |
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Post by guigsysEstring on Jul 19, 2016 14:02:09 GMT -5
Apparently the reissue will be announced the day before Noel's last gig at Brixton. To which, rather than doing the right thing and playing something from it..he will instead ignore BHN completely He may have something from it play over the tannoy as the house lights go up to coincide with a Be Here Now reissue advert backdrop on the empty stage, you never know....  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2016 14:11:17 GMT -5
I can only see him playing Don't Go Away. Maybe Angel Child again. I wonder if forgot Going Nowhere. That song would have been perfect on his acoustic tour in December.
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Post by andrewmattcoles on Jul 19, 2016 15:22:35 GMT -5
Apparently the reissue will be announced the day before Noel's last gig at Brixton. To which, rather than doing the right thing and playing something from it..he will instead ignore BHN completely He may have something from it play over the tannoy as the house lights go up to coincide with a Be Here Now reissue advert backdrop on the empty stage, you never know.... At this stage I will take that!! |
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Post by andrewmattcoles on Jul 19, 2016 15:30:03 GMT -5
I'll just leave this good article here... www.techdirt.com/articles/20100712/23482610186.shtmlIn short... if Oasis could sell 250,000 copies of Be Here Now (will never happen with a reissue) at an average price of $15.00 per record... then the average musicians cut is all of $87,750. There is a reason why bands, even the most successful ones, tour relentlessly. I believe guigsysEstring works on the inside as well, and can corroborate the article above. That article is a good description of the traditional record deal where an artist signs directly to a record label, in particular one of the majors. What I would say is the equal split between musicians is a bit general, as many artists where there is more than one individual have different shares to the members. The system did a good job of earning majors substantial profits, with Thorn EMI reporting £539,000,000 pre-tax profits back in 1996, and stating that with the business splitting in two (electrical & music) the music division was responsible for the lion's share of earnings. Meanwhile more recently Sony Music Entertainment reported third quarter earnings that comprised worldwide sales of $1.35BN with operating profits of $210,000,000 for the three months to Dec 31st 2014, so a full year's earnings could potentially still match 1990's earnings despite the 'doom' warnings we have had previously- Music Business Worldwide The article quoted by @kitjenson also does not cover publishing contracts in any depth which I will go into a little later in these ramblings. The Oasis catalogue is on a profit share scheme between Big Brother Recordings Ltd and Sony Music Entertainment which covers all territories and included the back catalogue as well as future releases, including reissues, etc.- Daily Mirror- June 2008 . A quick check at Companies House shows that the Oasis record label has four Directors which are Liam, Noel, Marcus Russell and Alec McKinley, with the latter doubling up as company secretary. These four gentlemen are also the only four shareholders listed, with 300 shares issued being split 120 each to the brothers (40% each) and 30 each to the managers (10% each). Assuming the initial deal with Sony Music Entertainment still stands then the profit share arrangement on the Oasis catalogue will see Big Brother Recordings Ltd receive it's share of the profit after agreed costs, which may not necessarily be 50%, before remitting it's own profits in the form of dividends to the shareholders after deducting any of it's own costs. These initial or later deductible costs I would presume will still include royalty payments to former members for their work on previous recordings, excluding Tony McCarroll who was on a separate contract and who was brought out of future claims as part of his 1999 settlement, and possibly Zak Starkey depending on what his financial arrangements were with the band. EDIT- I would assume Noel and Liam take their royalties along with the two managers taking their commissions as dividends, which would reduce their tax liability by paying a lower earnings limit or zero salary and making up the rest in annual payments. This further increases the amount one can earn net without the need to base yourself offshore, although that didn't stop U2 for example seeking to further limit their tax liabilities in Republic of Ireland by incorporating in territories with more favourable tax rates and systems. In fairness to Bono & Co. their charitable annual donations also contribute to a reduced tax bill as such actions are deductible. I think the problem when people refer to it as 'stealing' and such is that many simply do not understand the laws and I find their comments irritating in all honesty in much the same way as anyone commenting on a subject they clearly do not understand. I would stress I do not include politically minded commentators, including some on here such as theyknowwhatimean and matt as their objections to such arrangements and systems are based on political convictions rather than not understanding the issues or laws. andymorris is correct that Noel has publishing income with Sony Music, although this is separate from Big Brother Recordings Ltd and is collected under his 'Oasis Music' trading name. This is personal rather than a limited company and is for the publishing revenue accrued by his catalogue of songs released with Oasis, which was primarily published with Sony Music Publishing and it's subsidiaries, although Creation Songs Ltd (Alan McGee/Dick Green) also has a share in some titles from the first three albums. The income derived from this will primarily be split between Noel Gallagher and his publishers equally, whilst the other former songwriting members of Oasis will have their own publishing deals. Publishing can be very lucrative on it's own not only with airplay and record sales, but also for monetising the catalogue via advertising, covers, film or television synchronisation, etc. which can generate substantial sums as individual deals. Noel Gallagher will also be deriving a good income from his solo career, with Sour Mash Records Ltd having a similar structure to Big Brother except Noel holds 80% of the shares, with the two managers holding 10% each and all three being the only Directors with Alec once again doubling up as company secretary. Sour Mash Records Ltd will have distribution and licensing deals worldwide that are undoubtedly more favourable than new artists, and possibly even on better terms than Big Brother Records Ltd, so that in itself is a potential goldmine for revenue. The publishing for the solo material is wholly owned by Noel under his 'Dead Leg Music' trading name, so he will receive all publishing royalties due for these songs. In conclusion the Oasis catalogue is a valuable one for the brothers, although I would doubt a vinyl reissue will be a high earner overall, and will continue to earn a good income assuming they can continue to entice new listeners and repackage the catalogue in the coming years. Noel Gallagher meanwhile has the potential to earn a substantial amount above this with his solo career, which if he maintains it at it's current level or higher will continue to generate it's own successful revenue streams. These earnings and structures do not take touring into account, which is usually handled separately by an artist partnership or limited company in association with third party promoters. In Oasis case this is not relevant at this point, but in the event of a reunion I would assume it will be the brothers and their management minus fees for ex-members or salaries for session musicians to do a tour, which would generate tens of millions in ticket sales, merchandise, potential broadcast and follow up DVD releases, etc. as well as potentially boosting the back catalogue sales for Big Brother Recordings Ltd. In Noel's case he will have deals with third party promoters in which the artist share of the aforementioned live music revenue streams will be paid to him, minus management, touring musicians and associated touring costs, which again can generate a substantial income. Hope I haven't bored you all with too much information Interesting stuff |
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Post by mossy on Jul 20, 2016 2:53:37 GMT -5
Is today the day...
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Post by Gas Panic on Jul 20, 2016 3:07:48 GMT -5
I'm thinking a friday or a monday... |
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Post by andymorris on Jul 20, 2016 3:47:05 GMT -5
Thanx for the clarification guigsysEstring, very interesting stuff.
To sum up, Noel will make some sweet money out it, not too much by his standards, but enough to be happy at christmas
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2016 4:08:23 GMT -5
Supersonic and Be Here Now will be released in October (DVD release in December) but when will Knebworth come? With Supersonic in December?
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Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Jul 20, 2016 4:21:26 GMT -5
..that they're gonna throw it back to you? |
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Post by John William Anglin on Jul 20, 2016 4:32:00 GMT -5
..that they're gonna throw it back to you? Don't think you can just waltz in here with your David Hasselhoff good looks and say something cheesy like Beady’s Here Now would say and then steal him away from me, babe! Dankjé. |
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Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Jul 20, 2016 4:42:46 GMT -5
..that they're gonna throw it back to you? Don't think you can just waltz in here with your David Hasselhoff good looks and say something cheesy like Beady’s Here Now would say and then steal him away from me, babe! Dankjé. Please keep him, wouldn't touch him with a barge pole! |
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Post by John William Anglin on Jul 20, 2016 4:49:45 GMT -5
Don't think you can just waltz in here with your David Hasselhoff good looks and say something cheesy like Beady’s Here Now would say and then steal him away from me, babe! Dankjé. Please keep him, wouldn't touch him with a barge pole! Do you at least like my new Facebòók profile pic, babe? Thanks. |
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Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Jul 20, 2016 4:58:19 GMT -5
Please keep him, wouldn't touch him with a barge pole! Do you at least like my new Facebòók profile pic, babe? Thanks. I thought you liked Tom Brady? God bless. |
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Post by mossy on Jul 20, 2016 6:13:41 GMT -5
Do you at least like my new Facebòók profile pic, babe? Thanks. I thought you liked Tom Brady? God bless. Get a room! |
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Post by andymorris on Jul 20, 2016 8:05:01 GMT -5
I suspect Noel delayed the announcement for the delayed release.
He just love delaying stuff.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2016 8:11:49 GMT -5
He will probably delay his next solo album. The reason: he couldn't be arsed.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2016 16:49:04 GMT -5
Do you guys think that The Girl In The Dirty Shirt live at The Point will be on it? Maybe they still have the multitracks from it just like with DM reissue for the songs at Manchester Academy.
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Post by Gas Panic on Jul 20, 2016 18:16:32 GMT -5
Do you guys think that The Girl In The Dirty Shirt live at The Point will be on it? Maybe they still have the multitracks from it just like with DM reissue for the songs at Manchester Academy. That would be quite nice actually, the only ever live outing of a song that a lot of people really like. Makes sense. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2016 19:04:34 GMT -5
I expect the lyric video's of Be Here Now after the announcement.
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Post by morning_rain on Jul 21, 2016 2:34:22 GMT -5
Someday soon I'll wake up an see this thread is 200 pages long. Then I'll know it has been finally announced.
(And if it's 300 pages long I'll know Mustique are not included)
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Post by space75gr on Jul 21, 2016 3:44:23 GMT -5
my only hope is to hear demos/tracks with Liam's voice and naked version o the songs (always with Liam)
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Post by The Thieving Magpie on Jul 21, 2016 3:58:52 GMT -5
I suspect Noel delayed the announcement for the delayed release. He just love delaying stuff. delaying stuff? this?  |
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Post by Rolo on Jul 21, 2016 4:26:02 GMT -5
I have no interest in this reissue if it's a bonus disc with Noel sung demos and rarities again. Liam is the lead singer of the band ffs, give us something from him.
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5
Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5