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Post by liamgallagher1992 on Sept 4, 2017 5:24:52 GMT -5
Scenario: Liam goes solo after Oasis and had Andy and Gem in his band who help with songwriting (Beady Eye without the name). The whole promotion is the same. For the sake of the argument lets say the one love concert still happens and he plays The Roller instead of Wall Of Glass and the DGSS comes out under the name Liam Gallagher: As You Were.
Is there any difference at all in sales?
Wall Of Glass is a song that Liam would not have been capable of writing himself. And it's a perfect comeback single. But i think Liam has written better, and my favourite songs from the new album are penned by him. I just feel like the whole Beady Eye era has given him such a knock in confidence wit songwriting and he's almost conceded he cannot write an album himself. In reality i think it just needs someone to sit down with him and turn his ideas into genuine song structures with that more "professional" touch.
As much as i love the fact Liam is finally getting the success he deserves after Oasis, i still prefer the way Beady Eye were putting out completely their own stuff, and i think Liam and the people around him are going to now put all of the new success down to the songwriting help he has got for this album. FWIW definitely has its shine taken away for me somewhat by the fact the whole song is written by someone else. If you told me that was some of Liam's lyrics turned into a better song with help then it would have far more emotive value for me. Bold and Greedy Soul have genuine subject matter behind them and seeing the artist perform from the heart like that is what music is all about for me.
So will we ever see Liam take this approach for a full album or will the "failure" of Beady Eye/success of As You Were lead to the same approach for the future?
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Sept 4, 2017 5:45:31 GMT -5
I think the way Liam has approached this record was absolutely the right way to go. He has shortcomings in terms of writing that he has acknowledged and says he is still learning.
That being the case for the next record I would like him to do it a bit differently, this time he went to songwriters who already had the tunes written and he gave input, for the next one I'd like him to write all the songs and if he's struggling a few of them take them to some songwriters to fill in a bit here and there.
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Post by mancraider on Sept 4, 2017 5:46:10 GMT -5
He seems to have taken a particular shine to andrew watt so I can see him working with him again. Although I'd like to see him write an album with his band. Dan is a songwriter and was very involved in helping liam create demos from what ive read, plus drew seems very into different stuff and is very talented so I could see them coming up with something more organic than the hired gun approach of this album when it comes to songwriting.
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Post by morning_rain on Sept 4, 2017 5:55:04 GMT -5
Yes. He has good ideas but needs an experienced songwriter to shape them into good songs.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 5:56:29 GMT -5
Yes. Everyone's doing a good job. I'd like to see a lyricist working with him. But nothing too complicated, that's not his style.
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Post by liamgallagher1992 on Sept 4, 2017 5:59:48 GMT -5
Sorry everyone, changed the poll slightly so it matched the discussion better
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Post by freddy838 on Sept 4, 2017 6:41:53 GMT -5
I like the 50/50 split he's got pretty much with this record, so same again if he does another record. I still expect Liam and Noel's next release will be an Oasis EP of unused songs while they go out on tour.
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Post by Regi on Sept 4, 2017 7:46:17 GMT -5
It's up to him, if he feels he needs to. To be honest I'm quite impressed with the songs he has written himself for this album.
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Post by bardes on Sept 4, 2017 7:57:03 GMT -5
Definitely maybe.
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Post by ricardogce on Sept 4, 2017 9:06:46 GMT -5
Yes, but only to help push his own songs over the line. Liam has lots of interesting ideas that just need a more seasoned hand to steer them into greatness.
Noel is one of the greatest pop songwriters ever, so there's a tendency to dismiss Liam the way one would a child trying to imitate their older brother. But he wrote Songbird, Born on a Different Cloud, and I'm Outta Time, three songs I'd happily put up against all comers, bar Noel's own classics. Even with Beady Eye, my main criticism was that their songs started off promising, but didn't really resolve into anything beyond the cool riff or verse that originated them. With a bit of help, Liam could unlock his full potential. I definitely don't want him to be just a mouthpiece for whoever his label thinks is the hot writer of the day. There's more to him than just a cool voice and swagger.
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Post by andymorris on Sept 4, 2017 9:14:47 GMT -5
Liam needs a good producer to help him shape his songs, but i dont think he needs other songwriters.
We don't yet know what input he had in those other's guy's songs, but with hard work and more trust in his own songwriting abilities, he can write an entire record by himself.
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Post by Rolo on Sept 4, 2017 9:21:26 GMT -5
I think they have got the mix just right for this album, really happy with it.
Bold Greedy Soul When I'm In Need I Get By You Better Run Universal Gleam
They are the songs that are completely written by Liam I reckon so that's half the album then you have the other half where he has contributed ideas to other songs. Hope it stays the same for the next album.
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Post by walterglass on Sept 4, 2017 9:27:40 GMT -5
I think they have got the mix just right for this album, really happy with it. Bold Greedy Soul When I'm In Need I Get By You Better Run Universal Gleam They are the songs that are completely written by Liam I reckon so that's half the album then you have the other half where he has contributed ideas to other songs. Hope it stays the same for the next album. All I need?
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Sept 4, 2017 9:28:01 GMT -5
Liam needs a good producer to help him shape his songs, but i dont think he needs other songwriters. We don't yet know what input he had in those other's guy's songs, but with hard work and more trust in his own songwriting abilities, he can write an entire record by himself. I think there was to much at stake to do that on this record. If he released a stiff now it would more than likely be game over. From what I've heard the album sounds fine and there seems to be enough interest that I'm hopeful for a second record. We might see and I hope a different balance to the songwriting on that one.
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Post by Mean Mrs. Mustard on Sept 4, 2017 9:29:18 GMT -5
I'm writing this comment based on what I've heard so far and based on what Liam has written before this solo career.
I don't think he's too insecure to write a full album by himself, I just think he's not prolific enough.
Liam has shown us he's capable of writing some pretty good stuff, but just look at his Oasis output. They were few, but most of the time not exactly the strongest moments on the albums (bar Songbird, I'm Outta Time and Born On A Different Cloud). He has also shown us that he has very good ideas, but often doesn't really know how to make the most out of those ideas.
There's absolutely no shame in singing other people's songs. After all, that IS what he did in Oasis and what made them great. I don't mind the fact that For What It's Worth was written entirely by someone else (I do mind that it sounds like someone tried very hard to write a bland, radiofriendly Oasis-y song). A Liam Gallagher solo song doesn't have to be written partly by Liam to be credible or great, for me personally. As long as he can make them his own. Liam isn't a songwriter. He isn't Bob Dylan. Or Noel Gallagher. And that's okay. He's a singer. Besides, the general public can't tell who wrote a song they hear on the radio anyway, and they won't care.
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Post by andymorris on Sept 4, 2017 9:44:00 GMT -5
Liam needs a good producer to help him shape his songs, but i dont think he needs other songwriters. We don't yet know what input he had in those other's guy's songs, but with hard work and more trust in his own songwriting abilities, he can write an entire record by himself. I think there was to much at stake to do that on this record. If he released a stiff now it would more than likely be game over. From what I've heard the album sounds fine and there seems to be enough interest that I'm hopeful for a second record. We might see and I hope a different balance to the songwriting on that one. Yeah Warner went for the safe decision. But i'll always have the feeling that this record is Liam + some other songwriters. Which is ok when you're a pop star, less when you're a rock n roll icon. Call me crazy, but i like artists that do everything from writing to recording to performing. Producing is another story. But it feels a bit more authentic. I hope we'll get some more details about his involvement in the songs the other guys wrote, and that it's not just a fake co-crediting. Interviewers should focus on that side of things rather than the stupid Oasis questions. I'd love to see a documentary about those writing sessions, if they filmed bits of it (doubtful i know).
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Post by andymorris on Sept 4, 2017 9:50:42 GMT -5
I disagree. Liam is a songwriter. You dont write the tunes he wrote in Oasis (or Beady Eye) if you are not one. What Liam is missing is confidence in his own work. The rest will follow. Songwriting is like any other activity. It needs practice and hours of sweat. Sometimes a song will come in one minute, sometimes it will take years. Does Liam want to be a songwriter ? That's the real question here and it makes all the difference.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 10:09:51 GMT -5
Really surprised by the results of this. Liam could never write a Wall of Glass type tune and those are the kinds of songs I love to hear him sing.
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Post by mossy on Sept 4, 2017 10:47:52 GMT -5
Liam needs to bring in some electronic writers and producers and spread his wings and experiment with techno on his next album.
[Insert Pirate Smiley here]
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Post by freddy838 on Sept 4, 2017 11:30:45 GMT -5
I disagree. Liam is a songwriter. You dont write the tunes he wrote in Oasis (or Beady Eye) if you are not one. What Liam is missing is confidence in his own work. The rest will follow. Songwriting is like any other activity. It needs practice and hours of sweat. Sometimes a song will come in one minute, sometimes it will take years. Does Liam want to be a songwriter ? That's the real question here and it makes all the difference. All he can do is strum a guitar and write some pretty shitty lyrics. He himself admits that is all he can do, sometimes it comes off nicely with nice melodic verses but a whole album of it would be awful. You have two choices, a Liam-written album which would be awful or this mixture of his and someone else's songs, which is decent enough not to to tank and him to tour around the world with. I really don't think he can develop any further as a songwriter.
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Post by tezza198 on Sept 4, 2017 15:37:12 GMT -5
The songs he's written on the album are arguably the best (proper review once the album comes out) so he's defiantly a 'song writer' so to speak and songs like Wall of Glass & For What It's Worth were co-written so he deserves more credit than he's getting. But he should get help if required, why the fuck not? If the material is good people listening don't care who wrote it
He's written my favourite song of all time so in my opinion he is a great song writer
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Post by liamgallagher1992 on Sept 4, 2017 17:41:00 GMT -5
The songs he's written on the album are arguably the best (proper review once the album comes out) so he's defiantly a 'song writer' so to speak and songs like Wall of Glass & For What It's Worth were co-written so he deserves more credit than he's getting. But he should get help if required, why the fuck not? If the material is good people listening don't care who wrote it He's written my favourite song of all time so in my opinion he is a great song writer From the sounds of it FWIW and Wall Of Glass were just given to him and he changed a couple of words. He will be on the credits but only in the same way Harry Styles is on his stuff. I fully well accept Beady Eye needed to come to an end but i do prefer that way of writing your own stuff and putting your balls on the line. I see no reason why Liam cant go away and come back in a year with 10-15 melodies and ideas to turn into a strong album (provided he gets the right people to help) and i just think it would mean more to me as a fan. I also accept that getting Wall Of Glass given to him and putting that out there has helped draw in that casual fanbase and get his name out there. I think it's just a shame that we are accepting that is the only way to get success just because Beady Eye didnt market themselves the right way. At the end of the day im just glad he's being successful now and we can even have the discussion about a potential 2nd Liam Gallagher album.
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Post by liamgallagher1992 on Sept 4, 2017 17:49:16 GMT -5
I'm writing this comment based on what I've heard so far and based on what Liam has written before this solo career. I don't think he's too insecure to write a full album by himself, I just think he's not prolific enough. Liam has shown us he's capable of writing some pretty good stuff, but just look at his Oasis output. They were few, but most of the time not exactly the strongest moments on the albums ( bar Songbird, I'm Outta Time and Born On A Different Cloud). He has also shown us that he has very good ideas, but often doesn't really know how to make the most out of those ideas. There's absolutely no shame in singing other people's songs. After all, that IS what he did in Oasis and what made them great. I don't mind the fact that For What It's Worth was written entirely by someone else (I do mind that it sounds like someone tried very hard to write a bland, radiofriendly Oasis-y song). A Liam Gallagher solo song doesn't have to be written partly by Liam to be credible or great, for me personally. As long as he can make them his own. Liam isn't a songwriter. He isn't Bob Dylan. Or Noel Gallagher. And that's okay. He's a singer. Besides, the general public can't tell who wrote a song they hear on the radio anyway, and they won't care. Understand your points but he only written songs for 4 Oasis albums and thats 2 albums there he written what could be considered the best songs on (I'm Outta Time and Songbird) . Around 2002 they were sort of billing him as the one to take over the mantel from Noel and give Oasis the new lease of life in songwriting. To me there is a big difference between singing Noels songs and singing songs from a person completely unknown to us. I still know im listening to Noel projected through Liam and that was Oasis for me. That was the magic. Hearing he met up with a producer and recorded a song within a day is a bit like lets just get 11 songs together and brand it right and flog it to more people this time. Loses that magic of what a song and album is about.
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Post by liamgallagher1992 on Sept 4, 2017 17:53:50 GMT -5
I bought the discussion up after having a conversation with a mate who isnt a big Liam fan but loves Oasis/Noel. He really likes what Liam is doing now but was quick to put it all down to him getting his songs written for him.
I just find that annoying because it's that typical scenario of i know he didnt even give BE a chance because he knew LAG written the songs. Yet he finds out someone else has written Wall Of Glass and FWIW and gives them that chance. I find it difficult to believe those songs are miles above the standard of the best Beady Eye songs, even if i do accept they are better produced and more marketable.
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Post by themanwithnoname on Sept 4, 2017 17:54:35 GMT -5
Really surprised by the results of this. Liam could never write a Wall of Glass type tune and those are the kinds of songs I love to hear him sing. Exactly. To me the songs he's written for the album are typical Liam songs - fairly obvious melodies with cliche ridden lyrics which mean I always know what the next line's going to be. None of them really go anywhere or linger too long in the memory, perhaps with the exception of Greedy Soul which has a decent chorus. Wall of Glass is exactly the kind of song I want to hear Liam singing. If someone else has to do it, I really don't mind.
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