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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2020 7:19:05 GMT -5
I'll be honest, I don't understand why "Wonderwall" is such a divisive track for many music fans. I saw, heard and read many people literally hate on this track.
Harmonically: Fairly simple, that's true. But so are many pop songs that aren't as much hated. Tbh I think that A7sus4 just before the chorus is quite clever. Suspended chord that makes you wonder what's gonna happen next and then you get the Cadd9 perfectly starting the chorus.
Melodically: Again rather simple but effective. Lots of back and forth between two notes in the verses and a quite "rhythmic" melody, in fact quite rare that a ballad has such a busy melody line. Liam doesn't only sing chord tones, far from it actually, one note that stands out is the #4 in the pre chorus "And all the roads (that*)..." #4 is a F# note over a Cadd9 for example. Champagne Supernova is also one Oasis song that uses the sharp 4 iirc. The chorus has a huge emphasis on the dominant and the leading note, giving the chorus a melancholic feel.
Instrumentation: Haunting and quite rare for its time of release. Try to think of 90's songs that have the same kind of instrumentation, there aren't many. What makes it actually is the "waves" of mellotron in the chorus. Nothing groundbreaking technically, but very effective and as I said, haunting.
Vocals: And here's I think where the problem lies. "Wonderwall" wouldn't be as good without Liam's fantastic vocals but thinking about it, the nasal tone Liam uses might not be for everyone, in fact I heard many people mocking it, which blows my mind cos' I think it's perfect.
I still can't understand the hate. "Wonderwall" might be overplayed but it's still a great track with a lot of redeeming qualities.
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Post by matt on Aug 7, 2020 8:21:01 GMT -5
Here's one for you: the peak of Noel's melodic powers are the bridges across Be Here Now. Every single one, from "I met my maker and I made him cry..." to "Take me away, 'cos I just don't wanna stay!" is utterly superb. The bridge of Stand By Me is one of the most perfect melodies he ever wrote, and the "You've got a feeling lost inside..." bit on The Girl in the Dirty Shirt is fantastic, too. Don't get me started on how perfect My Big Mouth's is, either. Around this town, you've ceased to be...This is so true, I think you’ve nailed an aspect of the success and failings of the album with that. They’re so great that the choruses are sometimes an anti climax (I think Stand By Me and All Around The World - even Girl With Dirty Shirt - while they are fine choruses, are nowhere near as good as the unbelievable verse and bridges). Both tunes see Noel at his melodic peak in these sections but the choruses just seem so flat in comparison. Sad thing is that the songs are objectively really good but as Oasis nuts, we maybe listen and our expectations are going to unbelievable heights considering all the tunes released prior to BHN. There’s a mood when listening to it that says ‘this is approaching some of the greatest songs I’ve ever heard’ that then inevitably disappoints and falls short. Maybe it’s the one thing that kills Be Here Now - verses and bridges that are so good with choruses that just can’t meet the expectations. I think two of my favourite songs from the album - I Hope I Think I Know and It’s Getting Better Man are quite consistent in terms of quality for verse, bridge and chorus. It’s not erratic and there’s no great fluctuations in quality. While both songs don’t have the melodic peaks of the songs you mentioned, they don’t let you down with false expectations, they’re just generally very satisfying and there’s no regrets or question of ‘what if’ with them. Yet strangely they’re not better songs but I maybe have a more favourable opinion simply because they don’t give me false hope!
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Post by redvers on Aug 7, 2020 8:32:36 GMT -5
I'll be honest, I don't understand why "Wonderwall" is such a divisive track for many music fans. I saw, heard and read many people literally hate on this track. Harmonically: Fairly simple, that's true. But so are many pop songs that aren't as much hated. Tbh I think that A7sus4 just before the chorus is quite clever. Suspended chord that makes you wonder what's gonna happen next and then you get the Cadd9 perfectly starting the chorus. Melodically: Again rather simple but effective. Lots of back and forth between two notes in the verses and a quite "rhythmic" melody, in fact quite rare that a ballad has such a busy melody line. Liam doesn't only sing chord tones, far from it actually, one note that stands out is the #4 in the pre chorus "And all the roads (that*)..." #4 is a F# note over a Cadd9 for example. Champagne Supernova is also one Oasis song that uses the sharp 4 iirc. The chorus has a huge emphasis on the dominant and the leading note, giving the chorus a melancholic feel. Instrumentation: Haunting and quite rare for its time of release. Try to think of 90's songs that have the same kind of instrumentation, there aren't many. What makes it actually is the "waves" of mellotron in the chorus. Nothing groundbreaking technically, but very effective and as I said, haunting. Vocals: And here's I think where the problem lies. "Wonderwall" wouldn't be as good without Liam's fantastic vocals but thinking about it, the nasal tone Liam uses might not be for everyone, in fact I heard many people mocking it, which blows my mind cos' I think it's perfect. I still can't understand the hate. "Wonderwall" might be overplayed but it's still a great track with a lot of redeeming qualities. It's because hating popular things is cool
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Post by defmaybe00 on Aug 7, 2020 9:21:10 GMT -5
I'll be honest, I don't understand why "Wonderwall" is such a divisive track for many music fans. I saw, heard and read many people literally hate on this track. Harmonically: Fairly simple, that's true. But so are many pop songs that aren't as much hated. Tbh I think that A7sus4 just before the chorus is quite clever. Suspended chord that makes you wonder what's gonna happen next and then you get the Cadd9 perfectly starting the chorus. Melodically: Again rather simple but effective. Lots of back and forth between two notes in the verses and a quite "rhythmic" melody, in fact quite rare that a ballad has such a busy melody line. Liam doesn't only sing chord tones, far from it actually, one note that stands out is the #4 in the pre chorus "And all the roads (that*)..." #4 is a F# note over a Cadd9 for example. Champagne Supernova is also one Oasis song that uses the sharp 4 iirc. The chorus has a huge emphasis on the dominant and the leading note, giving the chorus a melancholic feel. Instrumentation: Haunting and quite rare for its time of release. Try to think of 90's songs that have the same kind of instrumentation, there aren't many. What makes it actually is the "waves" of mellotron in the chorus. Nothing groundbreaking technically, but very effective and as I said, haunting. Vocals: And here's I think where the problem lies. "Wonderwall" wouldn't be as good without Liam's fantastic vocals but thinking about it, the nasal tone Liam uses might not be for everyone, in fact I heard many people mocking it, which blows my mind cos' I think it's perfect. I still can't understand the hate. "Wonderwall" might be overplayed but it's still a great track with a lot of redeeming qualities. Honestly, I think people hate it because it's so popular and rather simple, nothing to do with the song itself
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Post by The Escapist on Aug 7, 2020 9:34:41 GMT -5
Here's one for you: the peak of Noel's melodic powers are the bridges across Be Here Now. Every single one, from "I met my maker and I made him cry..." to "Take me away, 'cos I just don't wanna stay!" is utterly superb. The bridge of Stand By Me is one of the most perfect melodies he ever wrote, and the "You've got a feeling lost inside..." bit on The Girl in the Dirty Shirt is fantastic, too. Don't get me started on how perfect My Big Mouth's is, either. Around this town, you've ceased to be...This is so true, I think you’ve nailed an aspect of the success and failings of the album with that. They’re so great that the choruses are sometimes an anti climax (I think Stand By Me and All Around The World - even Girl With Dirty Shirt - while they are fine choruses, are nowhere near as good as the unbelievable verse and bridges). Both tunes see Noel at his melodic peak in these sections but the choruses just seem so flat in comparison. Sad thing is that the songs are objectively really good but as Oasis nuts, we maybe listen and our expectations are going to unbelievable heights considering all the tunes released prior to BHN. There’s a mood when listening to it that says ‘this is approaching some of the greatest songs I’ve ever heard’ that then inevitably disappoints and falls short. Maybe it’s the one thing that kills Be Here Now - verses and bridges that are so good with choruses that just can’t meet the expectations. I think two of my favourite songs from the album - I Hope I Think I Know and It’s Getting Better Man are quite consistent in terms of quality for verse, bridge and chorus. It’s not erratic and there’s no great fluctuations in quality. While both songs don’t have the melodic peaks of the songs you mentioned, they don’t let you down with false expectations, they’re just generally very satisfying and there’s no regrets or question of ‘what if’ with them. Yet strangely they’re not better songs but I maybe have a more favourable opinion simply because they don’t give me false hope! I think the chorus of Stand By Me would have been properly beautiful if they'd have mixed the bass, piano, and strings in better. Plus, get Noel to do those "Nobody knowsss...yeeaaahhh, nobody knows" backing vocals he does in the acoustic by-the-pool version. I also love the chorus of All Around the World, but in general I do agree with your point. Magic Pie is the biggest culprit (should have saved The Masterplan for track three), but TGITDS and Fade In/Out fit the model too. That said, I do still love almost all the songs on Be Here Now and will always maintain that no drastic tracklist change was needed. Trim the fat and fix some of the production/arrangements and you'd have another classic album for me.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 7, 2020 12:00:41 GMT -5
I'll be honest, I don't understand why "Wonderwall" is such a divisive track for many music fans. I saw, heard and read many people literally hate on this track. Harmonically: Fairly simple, that's true. But so are many pop songs that aren't as much hated. Tbh I think that A7sus4 just before the chorus is quite clever. Suspended chord that makes you wonder what's gonna happen next and then you get the Cadd9 perfectly starting the chorus. Melodically: Again rather simple but effective. Lots of back and forth between two notes in the verses and a quite "rhythmic" melody, in fact quite rare that a ballad has such a busy melody line. Liam doesn't only sing chord tones, far from it actually, one note that stands out is the #4 in the pre chorus "And all the roads (that*)..." #4 is a F# note over a Cadd9 for example. Champagne Supernova is also one Oasis song that uses the sharp 4 iirc. The chorus has a huge emphasis on the dominant and the leading note, giving the chorus a melancholic feel. Instrumentation: Haunting and quite rare for its time of release. Try to think of 90's songs that have the same kind of instrumentation, there aren't many. What makes it actually is the "waves" of mellotron in the chorus. Nothing groundbreaking technically, but very effective and as I said, haunting. Vocals: And here's I think where the problem lies. "Wonderwall" wouldn't be as good without Liam's fantastic vocals but thinking about it, the nasal tone Liam uses might not be for everyone, in fact I heard many people mocking it, which blows my mind cos' I think it's perfect. I still can't understand the hate. "Wonderwall" might be overplayed but it's still a great track with a lot of redeeming qualities. Honestly, I think people hate it because it's so popular and rather simple, nothing to do with the song itself I have a different theory: Oasis have so many better songs in their catalogue (Slide Away, for one), that you can separate Oasis fans from the average listener, as the latter will almost always cite Wonderwall, to the frustration of the former. That’s the dichotomy.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2020 12:23:45 GMT -5
Honestly, I think people hate it because it's so popular and rather simple, nothing to do with the song itself I have a different theory: Oasis have so many better songs in their catalogue (Slide Away, for one), that you can separate Oasis fans from the average listener, as the latter will almost always cite Wonderwall, to the frustration of the former. That’s the dichotomy. I don't think it's the Oasis fans who hate "Wonderwall" the most. Most of the fans would still have it have in their top 20 at least. And yeah Slide Away is even better, utterly beautiful song from the lyrics, the melody to Liam's vocals (his best vocals maybe).
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Post by tiger40 on Aug 7, 2020 13:12:30 GMT -5
I don't hate Wonderwall it's one of my favourite Oasis songs. I wouldn't put it in my top 5 but definitely in my top 10. It's a classic & I've always loved it & always have. But I think there are better songs on (What's The Story) Morning Glory though such as Don't Look Back In Anger for example.
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Post by Aman on Aug 7, 2020 16:26:41 GMT -5
It's Good To Be Free's guitar solo. 😍😍😍
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Post by Bonehead's Barber on Aug 8, 2020 6:29:09 GMT -5
The more I think about it, the more I think Listen Up might be Oasis' best tune.
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Post by Aman on Aug 8, 2020 8:21:39 GMT -5
The more I think about it, the more I think Listen Up might be Oasis' best tune. I wish it had a 2nd verse it would've elevated the song further. I think the song starts to drag a tad by the end. But that verse, pre-chorus and chorus are strong but a 2nd verse would've been great.
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Post by tiger40 on Aug 8, 2020 12:55:01 GMT -5
I love Listen Up it's great & one of my favourite Oasis songs & b.sides. Infact it would probably be in my top 5 b.sides. I always have loved it.
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Post by oneofus on Aug 8, 2020 22:24:12 GMT -5
I love Listen Up it's great & one of my favourite Oasis songs & b.sides. Infact it would probably be in my top 5 b.sides. I always have loved it. Same
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 9, 2020 12:06:25 GMT -5
All the original members were from working class Manchester, and from council houses. Noel and Liam Gallagher were born to an alcoholic and abusive father. Noel Gallagher hasn’t studied any music theory or music studies. Noel Gallagher abused drugs, before quitting in 2000. (Liam Gallagher still does abuse drugs lol) Noel Gallagher had a severe stutter. Noel Gallagher is also dyslexic.
And in spite of these struggles, Noel became the de facto leader of, and incredible songwriter for, Oasis - which inturn became the band of a generation.
How’s that for inspiration?
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Post by Bonehead's Barber on Aug 9, 2020 12:07:07 GMT -5
The more I think about it, the more I think Listen Up might be Oasis' best tune. The more I think about it, the more I think Some Might Say might be Oasis' best tune.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 9, 2020 14:16:51 GMT -5
D’You Know What I Mean has the same chords as Wonderwall.
A song telling God that he doesn’t exist. Replicating the Be Here Now album cover as the set design. The phone box. Band looking cool as fuck. Amazing vocals. The guitar solo. Liam’s dancing. Top performance. Utterly ridiculous!
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 9, 2020 14:43:18 GMT -5
For a sibling rivalry that has often lacked harmony, Noel and Liam’s voices harmonizing is always absolutely stunning.
This live performance of Stop Crying Your Heart Out is just one of countless examples.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 9, 2020 15:03:49 GMT -5
The only names I will consider for my future children. If you know, you know.
Girl Names: Sally, Lyla, Elsa, Dot Boy Names: Ernie, Digsy, Abel, James
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Post by powerage09 on Aug 9, 2020 18:49:48 GMT -5
The only names I will consider for my future children. If you know, you know. Girl Names: Sally, Lyla, Elsa, Dot Boy Names: Ernie, Digsy, Abel, James Here's hoping your Mrs will be onside when the time comes. Mine declared war on Oasis and my fan girl-ish love for them from the second we got together, makes for an interesting car journey once she's realises I've put on a random June 2000 bootleg
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Post by GlastoEls on Aug 10, 2020 4:46:50 GMT -5
Annual moan that I didn’t get Knebworth tickets and didn’t realise at 17 you could show up and tout.
I’ll never get over it!
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Post by Bonehead's Barber on Aug 10, 2020 7:44:27 GMT -5
The more I think about it, the more I think Listen Up might be Oasis' best tune. The more I think about it, the more I think Some Might Say might be Oasis' best tune. The more I think about it, the more I think Wonderwall might be Oasis' best tune.
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Post by Flashbax on Aug 10, 2020 19:03:30 GMT -5
Where is this video sourced from? Never saw the Wonderwall peformance from the 1st nigth of them at Knebworth.
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Post by The Thieving Magpie on Aug 11, 2020 5:20:34 GMT -5
Where is this video sourced from? Never saw the Wonderwall peformance from the 1st nigth of them at Knebworth.
Live Forever Documentary.
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Post by Bonehead's Barber on Aug 11, 2020 8:02:52 GMT -5
The more I think about it, the more I think Some Might Say might be Oasis' best tune. The more I think about it, the more I think Wonderwall might be Oasis' best tune. The more I think about it, the more I think Slide Away might be Oasis' best tune.
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Post by defmaybe00 on Aug 11, 2020 8:39:33 GMT -5
The more I think about it, the more I think Wonderwall might be Oasis' best tune. The more I think about it, the more I think Slide Away might be Oasis' best tune. One of those tunes that sound perfect no matter which version Liam's vocals in the studio are incredible, the whole thing sounds mega, yet when Noel does it on acoustic/in those semi acoustic sets it sounds equally as amazing
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