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Post by World71R on Feb 5, 2019 14:49:39 GMT -5
Were people actually surprised Oasis broke up in August 2009? I wasn’t. Long long long time coming. No, I was more surprised that the SOTSOG tour didn't become the final tour of their career and instead they carried on for nearly a decade afterwards. The SOTSOG Tour would've been perfect, and the SOTSOG era too with Roll it Over as a fitting closer.
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Post by World71R on Feb 5, 2019 0:03:39 GMT -5
Did you guys listen to Wilco yet? Yes! A classic of theirs, in fact: It's a great guitar rock song, but yet is still so calming, and it's quite a gorgeous song. The two guitars soloing at the end sound fantastic too.
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Post by World71R on Jan 29, 2019 23:36:05 GMT -5
I love Riverman.
The arrangement and production is so silky smooth with that psychedelic and jazz-y sort of atmosphere and the gorgeous solos and riffs by the guitars and saxophone. The atmosphere is so ominous but dreamy. It's definitely one of the best solo Noel songs.
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Post by World71R on Jan 28, 2019 11:50:01 GMT -5
Some Might Say, Wonderwall, and Don't Look Back in Anger.
Stop Crying Your Heart Out's release deserves a nod too.
On each of the four, the A-side is stellar and the B-sides are quality too. I still think they should've done a SMS/Acquiesce double A-side but that's just me.
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Post by World71R on Jan 27, 2019 19:21:22 GMT -5
That's what he did for the album cover, too, and it's absolutely atrocious. This photo should've been the album cover: Imagine that, but with the NGHFB logo on there as well. It wouldn't have been great, but it would've been better than what we got (even the Where the City Meets the Sky cover, and name for that matter, is better). The whole aesthetic of the CY era was just awful, really. It all pales in comparison to the gorgeous artwork that was done for the WBTM? era. I remember creating this alternate album cover back in 2014. This pic would have made a proper cover. Yes! I remember that. That's what I was thinking of when I pointed out that picture I posted. I love that alternate cover.
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Post by World71R on Jan 26, 2019 15:16:00 GMT -5
How the fuck did Noel ever sign off on that. The pose and the clothes as well, his younger self would be tearing him a new one for all that. That's what he did for the album cover, too, and it's absolutely atrocious. This photo should've been the album cover: Imagine that, but with the NGHFB logo on there as well. It wouldn't have been great, but it would've been better than what we got (even the Where the City Meets the Sky cover, and name for that matter, is better). The whole aesthetic of the CY era was just awful, really. It all pales in comparison to the gorgeous artwork that was done for the WBTM? era.
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Post by World71R on Jan 25, 2019 0:11:45 GMT -5
I don't think that's an accurate comparison. Are there occassional Oasis songs that really sound like they could have been Beatles songs? I guess, and She's Electric comes to mind as one. But there you have Liam's unique vocals, and a sound that was one of their own. The thing with van Fleet is that they have, intentionally or not, copied/mimicked EVERYTHING from Led Zeppelin. From the vocals, lyrics and down to the guitar tone. Great if you're a cover band, but not for much else. SInce I havent't heard every song of theirs, is there one of theirs that you think definitely does not sound like Led Zeppelin? I'm sure there must be one. Haven't heard them all neither mate. Probably in the record. I think I've listened to an acoustic song that didn't sound like them really. Except for the vocals of course. I honestly like 3 songs of them which are Highway Tune,Black Smoke Rising and Flower Power/When The Curtain Falls. But I'm sure they will evolve into something else. For the worst or the best. But after all of the criticism the singer is a bit angry about it so I'm guessing he'll change their style. If they're smart, they'll change up the style to respond to the critics and show they have breadth. However, judging by their lack of response and little embrace of the Led Zeppelin comparisons, as opposed to an Oasis approach where they embraced the comparisons they received and made it their own to show how unique they are, I don't know if they will. I want them to do it because I feel like they could be a good group and just need that one song to encapsulate the mainstream with a good but evolved rock sound and build upon the success they're having while hushing the critics.
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Post by World71R on Jan 23, 2019 21:15:41 GMT -5
I don't know about a Dear Prudence lift since The Turning's outro has that covered. The song is good and an interesting experiment in chopping and screwing guitars & messing with electronics, but the quote that Noel had about how he came up with the song is likely what fuels the "Beatles-in-Rishikesh" comparisons when he talked about visiting the temples in Thailand got vibes from there that inspired it. Um, think the Dear Prudence steal is way more blatant on WFL - just makes the song sound like a parody IMHO. Never read that Noel quote - all opinion is based on the song itself. Can you seriously not hear the Dear Prudence bit? I can hear it a little bit with the gradually rising intro and a little in the rhythm, but not to the point where I'd call Who Feels Love? a complete Dear Prudence rip-off.
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Post by World71R on Jan 23, 2019 1:29:35 GMT -5
No.
Maybe for Heathen Chemistry if they would've done the whole back-to-basics approach right, instead of the self-production they did. Otherwise, no. Owen Morris and the band produced something special in the '90s with the trilogy of DM, MG, and BHN, but it was time to move on. Noel needed a producer who was going to listen to his thoughts, respond to it, and challenge him, with members who could do all that aside from challenge him, for album #4. It makes me sort of wish that Paul Stacey had joined the band as a guitarist/bassist and then Noel had gotten someone else to be a guitarist/bassist who had similar abilities as Stacey (like Johnny Marr as it was rumored at one time).
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Post by World71R on Jan 23, 2019 1:17:10 GMT -5
Did some homework tonight so my music was a little lighter and contemplative. I ended up listening to:
Kid A by Radiohead, Zooropa by U2 (with Hold Me, Thrill Me... as the alternate track 2), and Original Soundtracks 1 by Passengers/U2
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Post by World71R on Jan 23, 2019 0:58:51 GMT -5
When Liam sings "We're getting better man" with that sneer and grit, I absolutely believe it. It's Getting Better (Man!!) is such an underrated song and it's a shame that the vocals are so repetitive towards the end and that there isn't just straight guitar there. There's some awesome playing beneath the vocals but both the vocals and the guitar lose their power with that repetition.
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Post by World71R on Jan 22, 2019 23:24:31 GMT -5
Some Zooropa thoughts:
The Edge's outro guitar solo on Some Days Are Better Than Others is absolutely killer. I love the blistering distortion on it and the colorful effects on his parts in the song.
Daddy's Gonna Pay... has some of the hardest hitting drums I've heard in a rock song. It bursts through upon entry and the tuning makes it so dynamic.
The First Time is a gorgeous tune and is right around the top 25/30 in terms of best U2 songs (along with album mates Zooropa, Stay, and Lemon). It's certainly one of their most underrated and has one of the best build-ups on a U2 song.
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Post by World71R on Jan 22, 2019 20:30:09 GMT -5
I always feel like people like him are going into Be Here Now thinking "this album is rubbish, let's see why". For sure it's a flawed and messy album and could have been a hell of a lot better, but at it's core there is a large crop of great melodies, vocals, and vintage Oasis optimism. I posted the three changes I think would make the album great on r/oasis: 1 - Good production. The album should have all the bass, strings, guitars, and vocals layered perfectly like Morning Glory did, but maybe a bit heaver. This is actually the most important - most of the songs on Be Here Now are fantastic but the life is sucked out of them with the over-cooked mushy production and arrangements. 2 - Swap Magic Pie and Fade In/Out for The Masterplan (should have been saved), Going Nowhere, and Stay Young. I love Fade In/Out personally but it could probably have been used as a cool b-side rather than a track on an album that was meant to save songwriting or whatever. 3 - Some edits. D'You Know What I Mean?, Stand By Me, TGITDS, All Around the World, and It's Gettin' Better (Man!!) could all have been shortened. If you're interested I did edit them and some other tunes from the time on my YouTube channel: www.youtube.com/channel/UC3YRG3kayLESRzO6w-zlr3w?view_as=subscriberI agree. Although I think Fade In-Out could possibly stay. It just needed to be edited down a little bit. I like the widescreen sound it has to it and how different it is from other Oasis works. That can stay as a representation that they were doing something different and also as a cool mid-album gem. The songs being edited down would've helped to magnify the grandiose nature of AATW and how special it and the Reprise are. By the time you get to there with the album is, it's a bit much with how long it's been already that throwing a 9+ minute song on there is just a bit much, especially for any casual fans. AATW shouldn't have been 9 minutes long (8:20 or so is good enough) and it should've been separated more from the Reprise than it is. Move AATW to around the middle of the album and maybe after The Masterplan (in place of Fade In-Out), like you'd have it in your hypothetical album, then put all the tracks after Fade In-Out after AATW as it is (with necessary edits & changes), but swapping Be Here Now & Stay Young around a bit, and you'd have an awesome close to it all. So basically a tracklisting of: D'You Know What I Mean?, My Big Mouth, Be Here Now, Stand By Me, I Hope I Think I Know, The Girl in the Dirty Shirt, The Masterplan, All Around the World, Don't Go Away, Stay Young, It's Getting Better (Man!!), and All Around the World Reprise (with certain tracks getting edited down of course; you could take or leave BHN too imo).
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Post by World71R on Jan 22, 2019 20:14:55 GMT -5
I don't think it's as much about the material as it is about Liam and also the approach to the album. If Noel hadn't rushed the album like he did and gotten Liam in to sing on more of the songs, like Full On, One Way Road, there would've been two more Liam-sung songs to put on the album and room for a song like Little by Little or Revolution Song to go on the album to make it 10 quality songs with still only 2 of them being Noel-sung. Additionally, more time on the album would've meant for more of a thought-out approach and sound to the album instead of some of the songs that turn out rather muddy and distorted due to the mixing and production to fill out the sound. So are you dumping SMC and WDIAGW in your revised playlist? Because if not you’ll have 3-4 Noel songs. I’m not convinced he could sing One Way Road, Revolution Song or Little By Little. Not at all. I'm saying if Liam had come in and done vocals for Full On and One Way Road (or another quality Noel-sung song he could've done), then you could have those two in there, plus Where Did it All Go Wrong? and the other tracks, instead of piling on the Noel-sung songs to get quality. Obviously that's hypothetical so I would still put Let's All Make Believe in for Little James and stick Full On in there somewhere in place of Put Yer Money..., then place I Can See a Liar after Who Feels Love? and before Full On, but even that's not ideal. There's just too many Noel-sung B-sides to choose from and not enough Liam-sung ones (only one in fact) to make a balanced album that doesn't have any sore thumbs on it.
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Post by World71R on Jan 22, 2019 18:30:50 GMT -5
Bottom line is Noel didn’t have the songs. Didn’t have enough material to round out a solid 10-11 track album that Noel boasted about for much of 1999. People always act like LAMB is the magic silver bullet. It’s not. It would help but even with its inclusion it still is lacking. I don't think it's as much about the material as it is about Liam and also the approach to the album. If Noel hadn't rushed the album like he did and gotten Liam in to sing on more of the songs, like Full On, One Way Road, there would've been two more Liam-sung songs to put on the album and room for a song like Little by Little or Revolution Song to go on the album to make it 10 quality songs with still only 2 of them being Noel-sung. Additionally, more time on the album would've meant for more of a thought-out approach and sound to the album instead of some of the songs that turn out rather muddy and distorted due to the mixing and production to fill out the sound.
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Post by World71R on Jan 22, 2019 12:42:06 GMT -5
I loved that Oasis logo. I used to draw it all over my schoolbooks. They had a very strong visual direction going for the Dig Out Your Soul era. Guess that kind of thing just furthers Lennon2217 and others' theory that they were more a brand than a band in the 00s. Still, I dug it at the time. I dig it as well. It's just a shame that relations between Liam and Noel seemingly fell apart somewhere along the way in the DOYS era and led to some of the songs not getting finished and then the ultimate fall out towards the end of the era that was the final nail in the coffin.
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Post by World71R on Jan 21, 2019 19:38:46 GMT -5
Definitely Maybe:
1. Live Forever 2. Slide Away 3. Bring it on Down
Morning Glory:
1. Champagne Supernova 2. Don't Look Back in Anger 3. Some Might Say
Be Here Now:
1. D'You Know What I Mean? 2. Don't Go Away 3. It's Getting Better (Man!!!)
SOTSOG:
1. Roll it Over 2. Gas Panic! 3. Go Let it Out
Heathen Chemistry:
1. Stop Crying Your Heart Out 2. Songbird 3. The Hindu Times
Don't Believe the Truth (this one was surprisingly difficult):
1. The Importance of Being Idle 2. Turn Up the Sun 3. Part of the Queue
Dig Out Your Soul: 1. The Shock of the Lightning 2. Falling Down 3. The Turning
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Post by World71R on Jan 21, 2019 19:34:55 GMT -5
Agreed. At the time it felt like the band held it in VERY high regard as well. Personally I could never get past the Dear Prudence lift and the fact it all sounded a bit too 'let's do a Beatles-in-Rishikesh song!' Noel did an acoustic version that was ok though. I don't know about a Dear Prudence lift since The Turning's outro has that covered. The song is good and an interesting experiment in chopping and screwing guitars & messing with electronics, but the quote that Noel had about how he came up with the song is likely what fuels the "Beatles-in-Rishikesh" comparisons when he talked about visiting the temples in Thailand got vibes from there that inspired it.
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Post by World71R on Jan 21, 2019 19:25:02 GMT -5
Noel has said the same recently, hasn't he? I think he's very inspired creatively right now, but chances are he'll never break out of his release cycle mold. Fucker could put together a 3 or 4 record box set if he wanted to but it won't go to No.1. Maybe the best thing would be to break that streak so the pressure is gone from future recordings. At this point in his career does going #1 matter? It doesn’t alter his legacy. He’s career is already robust. I never listen to bands or artists and think oh this was their 8th #1. I only ask myself if the music is good or not. Is the art worth it? Neil Young, Bob Dylan, Thom Yorke, Damon Albarn, these guys don’t care anymore if they are #1 or not. It frankly doesn’t matter. Definitely. Caring about #1s late in your career when it's not gonna happen and compromising your art gets you to where U2 has been with their last three albums. Albeit there's some good songs on each of those three albums, and NLOTH minus the middle three is a very good album, but you don't get a fulfilled vision of what the songs should be, as has happened with SOI and SOE.
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Post by World71R on Jan 21, 2019 2:00:15 GMT -5
Having just listened to OK Computer and seeing some similarities, in some ways, between that and SOTSOG, I could imagine Noel was looking to go for an evolution like what Radiohead did between The Bends and OKC to where there was more electronic work and different influences incorporated into the sound to help broaden the band's sound. So I think he meant a musical approach, but then with Guigs & Bonehead leaving and Noel coming off of cocaine but getting looped into prescription drugs, it turned into an emotional approach and had an impact on the musical approach, since he really seemed to rush the songs to get it out as a product and not an actual work like he alluded to in '97. Noel really just needed to get off coke and then have some time to work through prescription drugs and the comedown, as well as creating some new songs and sounds, and working with a new producer, then really work on a new album. A 2002/3 release, with a mix of different songs from between 1998-2002 and some other songs and sounds that naturally would've come with the process, would've been optimal. Noel started out on the right foot. New producer (Mark Stent), recording in a private mansion in France, no booze allowed. The ingredients were there. - Fucking In The Bushes - Go Let It Out - Who Feels Love? - Gas Panic - Roll It Over These are all good songs. Different sounding songs. Steps in a more bold direction. Especially for Oasis in 1999. The album gets bogged down with some Dad Rock tunes like Sunday Morning Call and Where Did It All Go Wrong (A tune I enjoy a lot) but having them back to back doesn't show Oasis in their best light. Little James sounds cool but the lyrics, I don't know I was ready for that in 1999/2000. Then we get Put Yer Money Where Yer Mouth Is and I Can See A Liar. Two under cooked songs. This is when Oasis began half the record is good trend that they never overcame until they broke up. Noel was heading down the right path initially........ That is true. I even think Sunday Morning Call and Where Did it All Go Wrong? both had potential but didn't get treated properly, as you can see by the acoustic version of SMC and the demo version of the latter. Even Put Yer Money Where Yer Mouth Is tries to be different to some degree but just is under-cooked in its treatment, as you said. Full On was the song Noel should've pushed for Liam to sing, instead of that, and you can't forget Let's All Make Believe. With Full On, LAMB, the demo version of Where Did it All Go Wrong?, and a more acoustic SMC (or even One Way Road which is a similar song), you have a good nine tracks. The problem with the era is Noel, simple as that. Too bogged down from not sticking to a clear and focused direction, with the music echoing that. I think the exit of Bonehead and Guigs in the early stages of the album messed things up and Noel should've taken a break after that to assess the direction of the band and get new members. SOTSOG suffers from over production, to some degree, but oddly enough it also suffers from being under-developed in some places, as a result of them leaving which messed with the direction of the sessions and caused Noel to seek other means of filling the soundscape.
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Post by World71R on Jan 20, 2019 19:25:18 GMT -5
I wonder what kind of LP4 Noel was imagining when he was making those "Be Here Now is good, but the next one will be better" comments in 1997. I can't imagine he envisaged something as pessimistic and morose as SOTSOG became, although he did want to approach it in "a different frame of mind" - did he mean emotionally or musically? It would have been cool if his optimistic frame of mind had merged with the desire to experiment at some point, we never really got an Oasis track that was both happy and different, other than maybe The Importance of Being Idle, which was fantastic. Having just listened to OK Computer and seeing some similarities, in some ways, between that and SOTSOG, I could imagine Noel was looking to go for an evolution like what Radiohead did between The Bends and OKC to where there was more electronic work and different influences incorporated into the sound to help broaden the band's sound. So I think he meant a musical approach, but then with Guigs & Bonehead leaving and Noel coming off of cocaine but getting looped into prescription drugs, it turned into an emotional approach and had an impact on the musical approach, since he really seemed to rush the songs to get it out as a product and not an actual work like he alluded to in '97. Noel really just needed to get off coke and then have some time to work through prescription drugs and the comedown, as well as creating some new songs and sounds, and working with a new producer, then really work on a new album. A 2002/3 release, with a mix of different songs from between 1998-2002 and some other songs and sounds that naturally would've come with the process, would've been optimal.
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Post by World71R on Jan 19, 2019 16:18:36 GMT -5
This heavyweight of a revolutionary rock album. Bar Fitter Happier, this is an incredible piece of art and one of the greatest rock albums of all-time. This is exactly what the rock scene needed at the time of its release and there's a wide range of influences I can think of off the top of my head: Led Zeppelin, U2 (whether Radiohead fans want to admit it or not), Kraftwerk, Pink Floyd; the genres of electronic music, jazz music, the sub-genres of progressive rock and of course alternative rock, the latter which Radiohead emerged from. There's some awesome songwriting going on in addition to all to this sort of musical eclecticism and it is just some mind-blowing stuff hearing it all the way through for the first time. Even with songs like Paranoid Android that I've heard many times before, I'm still blown away. Listening to this album, I see where Noel was trying to go with Standing on the Shoulders of Giants and where he received the influence. I wish he had spent more time fleshing out some of the songs on SOTSOG and really experimenting more. What makes OKC great is that there is great care put into each song and it truly builds upon what has come before. There's some songs on SOTSOG that do that (the first two tracks, Gas Panic!, Roll it Over, Let's All Make Believe, the demo of Where Did it All Go Wrong? w/t the drum loop) but it's not a full commitment and full change like OKC is, and OKC isn't even as drastic as Kid A was in relation to The Bends. OKC, though. 9.5/10. Only 0.5 off for Fitter Happier. Yes! Radiohead was one band I was late to. Four years ago when I started to get more serious about my music listening and playing, they were one band I had a few songs from on my iPod, but I never dived into their stuff too deeply, until now.
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Post by World71R on Jan 18, 2019 19:31:05 GMT -5
This heavyweight of a revolutionary rock album. Bar Fitter Happier, this is an incredible piece of art and one of the greatest rock albums of all-time. This is exactly what the rock scene needed at the time of its release and there's a wide range of influences I can think of off the top of my head: Led Zeppelin, U2 (whether Radiohead fans want to admit it or not), Kraftwerk, Pink Floyd; the genres of electronic music, jazz music, the sub-genres of progressive rock and of course alternative rock, the latter which Radiohead emerged from. There's some awesome songwriting going on in addition to all to this sort of musical eclecticism and it is just some mind-blowing stuff hearing it all the way through for the first time. Even with songs like Paranoid Android that I've heard many times before, I'm still blown away. Listening to this album, I see where Noel was trying to go with Standing on the Shoulders of Giants and where he received the influence. I wish he had spent more time fleshing out some of the songs on SOTSOG and really experimenting more. What makes OKC great is that there is great care put into each song and it truly builds upon what has come before. There's some songs on SOTSOG that do that (the first two tracks, Gas Panic!, Roll it Over, Let's All Make Believe, the demo of Where Did it All Go Wrong? w/t the drum loop) but it's not a full commitment and full change like OKC is, and OKC isn't even as drastic as Kid A was in relation to The Bends. OKC, though. 9.5/10. Only 0.5 off for Fitter Happier.
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Post by World71R on Jan 18, 2019 17:44:29 GMT -5
Definitely Maybe is amazing, but replace Shakermaker with Fade Away and it's just right imo. Digsy's Dinner could stay since it just has such an awesome, youthful punk vibe that embodies DM perfectly.
Also, it's crazy how much Columbia grows on you. I didn't think anything of it the first few times I heard it, but just listening closer at everything going on (the guitar riffs, the MBV-like wall of bass and electric guitars, the backing vocals, the little samples), it becomes something really bloody cool, epic, and special. I love it.
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Post by World71R on Jan 18, 2019 13:22:08 GMT -5
Anyone got on any info on the Air Studio recordings? I actually think I prefer them versions more than the album versions. Liam's vocals are really great, obviously touched up but always wondered how they were recorded. Live or in a studio. Fucking amazing. I agree. I love the live, but still somewhat clean sound of these recordings. Honestly, you could put another rhythm guitar track in the right channel and it'd be perfect to put on an album. The AYW version of Greedy Soul is too soft and pop-y with the acoustic guitars and the louder drums and bassline, instead of how it is here with the electric guitar. Good tune, though. Perfect for Liam, and you can tell that it was one of the tunes that he had more input on. The guitar riff even reminds me a bit of New Year's Day by U2.
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