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Post by morning_rain on Apr 9, 2020 11:01:58 GMT -5
I thought Brian Cannon also hinted at working with Noel 3-5 years ago too? I remember him dropping some hints that made me think he was working on something with Noel but I don't think anything ever emerged. Maybe I was reading him wrong. I remember that too, it was before the CY release and we all asumed he was talking about the artwork for that album. |
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Post by marianna on Apr 9, 2020 13:28:02 GMT -5
I'm absolutely unaware of any possible relation between one thing and the cancellation of the movie. But, just in order to add some more info Mike Bruce didn't share: Last summer (I believe) when split videos for different tracks came up, there was a backlash from asian (mostly South Corean) fans who noticed something, unfortunately, familiar to them, on the Fort Knox video. The Japanese Imperial flag appears as a badge on a leather jacket, worn by of one of the characters. This is the flag: https://www.instagram.com/p/B1iSItMAT5k That possibly went unnoticed by many of us, westerners… But there's a HUGE problem with it. That flag is the asian equivalent to the Nazi flag. I don't know much about it, just what those fans were reporting: Ignition was contacted by the fans, they took time to reply and I don't Know what their reply was. Mike Buce was contacted, he was made aware of the meaning of that flag and asked to remove it from the video. His reply on instagram: Block. Block everyone, and this I know for sure, bc I was one of the people he blocked. ![]() Obviously, I have no proof whatsoever of any relation between one thing and another and it probably is just the AA story repeating itself, but I think this is important info people should know about. |
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Post by eleysium on Apr 9, 2020 15:19:37 GMT -5
Very interesting.
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Post by andymorris on Apr 9, 2020 18:32:07 GMT -5
Two sides to every stories, guess its easier to blame grumpy Noel than admit he fucked up in a big way.
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Post by LlAM on Apr 10, 2020 8:20:24 GMT -5
So this guy basically spent two years making a glorified music video or did I miss something?
If the case, how would it hurt Noel to let the guy release it?
He could let the guy have his name all over it and just have a "feat music by Noel Gallagher" in the title somewhere?
Or just release it on Noel's youtube channel and see if it generates a few views?
I don't get it.
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Post by andymorris on Apr 10, 2020 12:25:04 GMT -5
So this guy basically spent two years making a glorified music video or did I miss something? If the case, how would it hurt Noel to let the guy release it? He could let the guy have his name all over it and just have a "feat music by Noel Gallagher" in the title somewhere? Or just release it on Noel's youtube channel and see if it generates a few views? I don't get it. Well it seems kinda obvious why Noel vetoed, there's a nazi-like flag on it, he's big in Asia. Can they technically remove it (without it costing a lot of money, if it's like every shot of the guy) ? Not sure. But seems like this is the main reason. |
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Post by oasisunited on Apr 10, 2020 13:59:41 GMT -5
Isn't the most logical explanation that it took Mike Bruce 2 years to produce this film and Noel has already moved on from WBTM?. Noel notoriously doesn't linger on releases, on top of the fact that he hates music videos. It seems most likely that timing just didn't work out, as all the other issues could have been resolved, especially if there was money to be had.
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Post by mystoryisgory on Apr 10, 2020 23:39:49 GMT -5
Re: the rising sun flag of Imperial Japan, fly that flag in Korea, China, Taiwan, Philippines, Singapore, anywhere in Asia other than Japan you will encounter massive backlash. That is a symbol of hate, racism, and genocide throughout Asia, because that's what Japan did to other Asian countries during World War II. It wasn't just the Nazis. My grandparents on both sides of my family had to endure Japanese colonial rule or Japanese invasion. Plus, unlike the German government, the Japanese government never apologized for the vast majority of atrocities it committed. So I completely understand why Korean fans were mad at Noel and his team. Seeing that flag makes my blood boil too, just as much as seeing a Nazi or Confederate flag does. This isn't anti-Japanese sentiment btw, no more than being anti-Nazi is anti-German. Japanese are good, very friendly people! It's just that the Japanese government needs to own up to what it did all those decades ago.
I say this just in case there are people here who aren't the most aware of the historical context. I'm sure it was just an oversight on Noel's team's part, and they didn't mean to do any harm, a lot of Westerners don't know what that flag symbolizes.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2020 5:59:05 GMT -5
Is there a reason why this character would wear the flag, or is it more likely just something the stylist thought looked nice and didn't know the story behind it? Anyone seen the film?
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Post by oasispodcast on Apr 11, 2020 6:21:55 GMT -5
Re the flag my understanding is it was just something the actress turned up wearing - the jacket had a number of different patches on it, no one had any clue the symbol would cause offence
There was a case in the U.K. recently where Ant & Dec wore it on karate headbands which generated some complaints - it’s in the news today about whether it should be used at the Tokyo olympics
Regarding the character in the film she’s pretty despicable, very violent etc so it’s not glamorising it
I completely understand if it would cause offence though
Just to say though that controversy was months and months later - that’s not the reason why it was shelved back in 2018
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Post by The Chief on Apr 11, 2020 8:05:48 GMT -5
I stopped buying shit from that c*nt (Noel) after DOYS. Hi Liam! |
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Post by popeyebonaparte on Apr 11, 2020 8:21:12 GMT -5
Re the flag my understanding is it was just something the actress turned up wearing - the jacket had a number of different patches on it, no one had any clue the symbol would cause offence There was a case in the U.K. recently where Ant & Dec wore it on karate headbands which generated some complaints - it’s in the news today about whether it should be used at the Tokyo olympics Regarding the character in the film she’s pretty despicable, very violent etc so it’s not glamorising it I completely understand if it would cause offence though Just to say though that controversy was months and months later - that’s not the reason why it was shelved back in 2018 In what way does she seem despicable or violent??? |
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Post by oasispodcast on Apr 11, 2020 11:49:56 GMT -5
I haven’t watched it in a while but they commit armed robbery then go on the run.
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Post by marianna on Apr 11, 2020 14:50:02 GMT -5
Re the flag my understanding is it was just something the actress turned up wearing - the jacket had a number of different patches on it, no one had any clue the symbol would cause offence There was a case in the U.K. recently where Ant & Dec wore it on karate headbands which generated some complaints - it’s in the news today about whether it should be used at the Tokyo olympics Regarding the character in the film she’s pretty despicable, very violent etc so it’s not glamorising it I completely understand if it would cause offence though Just to say though that controversy was months and months later - that’s not the reason why it was shelved back in 2018 I was listening to the podcast wondering if you would ask him about it. But then you didn't and, obviously he didn't bring it up. If the project was shelved in 2018 it died a bad death in 2019. From then on I was part of those not wanting it to see the light of day. I just find it kind of ironic he gave people, that were not accusing him of something, but making him aware of something, the very same treatment Noel gave him. Not only did he ignore, he blocked people with no explanation or even acknowlegement. Gloryfing it or not, making a mistake is fair, not acknowleging it and feeling in the right to outright ignore it, and "release" it unedited is simply outright arrogant. I wonder how people would react if there was the actual Nazi Germany flag there. Well, it means the very same thing. |
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Post by bt95 on Apr 11, 2020 15:03:09 GMT -5
Just realised I've had this film for like 6 months.
It's alright (rewatched it after slaging it) .
But, it's a shame if Mike put a lot of work into it etc and for it not to see the light of day. Bad form from Noel and his team.
EDIT: Wasn't aware about the stuff about the flag. Meh, could be a bit of both. Dunno. Need to listen to the episode yet but it's a shame it didn't work out.
Just listening to the podcast and it’s really clear Mike obviously dedicated a hell of a lot to it and he deserved to know why it didn’t see the light of day.
It’s not great and Ignition really do seem to be totally inept. And yeh, Noel comes across very badly and shouldn’t be relying on management to coordinate in that way.
Speaking from personal experience of dealing with people in the music industry, especially management and how flakey artists can be (agree to something and then change their mind and just get ‘management’ to try and sort it) it can be really aggravating.
If it was about the flag, then they should have let Mike know. It could well be a very valid reason but there’s no need to go around about it that way.
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Post by bt95 on Apr 11, 2020 15:09:39 GMT -5
I thought Brian Cannon also hinted at working with Noel 3-5 years ago too? I remember him dropping some hints that made me think he was working on something with Noel but I don't think anything ever emerged. Maybe I was reading him wrong. As far as I'm aware Brian hasn't been working or come close to working with either Gallagher in a long, long time. I could be wrong but from a very, very brief chat and then speaking with other people who know both that seems to be the case. Hopefully some time down the road that changes. I doubt they had a falling out or anything. Life just moves on. |
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Post by carlober on Apr 11, 2020 16:02:55 GMT -5
I thought Brian Cannon also hinted at working with Noel 3-5 years ago too? I remember him dropping some hints that made me think he was working on something with Noel but I don't think anything ever emerged. Maybe I was reading him wrong. As far as I'm aware Brian hasn't been working or come close to working with either Gallagher in a long, long time. I could be wrong but from a very, very brief chat and then speaking with other people who know both that seems to be the case. Hopefully some time down the road that changes. I doubt they had a falling out or anything. Life just moves on. I clearly remember a couple of photos taken by Brian Cannon in 2014 while Noel was recording CY. I have them somewhere. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2020 17:35:48 GMT -5
As far as I'm aware Brian hasn't been working or come close to working with either Gallagher in a long, long time. I could be wrong but from a very, very brief chat and then speaking with other people who know both that seems to be the case. Hopefully some time down the road that changes. I doubt they had a falling out or anything. Life just moves on. I clearly remember a couple of photos taken by Brian Cannon in 2014 while Noel was recording CY. I have them somewhere. These ones?   |
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Post by carlober on Apr 12, 2020 2:43:52 GMT -5
@salasana, yes, those are the ones
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Post by bt95 on Apr 12, 2020 4:42:26 GMT -5
carlober fair play! Maybe they were simply just pictures of the recording sessions and not that he was going to be doing the album cover etc? Anyway, glad to have been proved wrong.
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Post by bt95 on Apr 12, 2020 19:18:18 GMT -5
Isn't the most logical explanation that it took Mike Bruce 2 years to produce this film and Noel has already moved on from WBTM?. Noel notoriously doesn't linger on releases, on top of the fact that he hates music videos. It seems most likely that timing just didn't work out, as all the other issues could have been resolved, especially if there was money to be had. Tbf it doesn’t take much to give feedback during the process which he had been asking for. As someone who freelances for a living you rely on your clients to be keeping you updated as to what their intentions are if it’s work which is going to be taking your time (and money). They could have told him to stop. Also, doing stuff like make Mike pay for stuff out of his own pocket is out of line too. I’ll defend Noel/his team when I don’t think they’ve done wrong and are getting unfairly slated, but in this case all they had to do was offer a decent explanation and have some common courtesy it seems. Also, it was only over the course of seven months (from filming in Feb 2018 on that US tour Noel did through to Mike submitting the final film in October 2018). |
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Post by bt95 on Apr 12, 2020 19:22:05 GMT -5
So this guy basically spent two years making a glorified music video or did I miss something? If the case, how would it hurt Noel to let the guy release it? He could let the guy have his name all over it and just have a "feat music by Noel Gallagher" in the title somewhere? Or just release it on Noel's youtube channel and see if it generates a few views? I don't get it. Well it seems kinda obvious why Noel vetoed, there's a nazi-like flag on it, he's big in Asia. Can they technically remove it (without it costing a lot of money, if it's like every shot of the guy) ? Not sure. But seems like this is the main reason. Then they should have told him that mate. Do feel for Mike in this instance. If he’s been ignoring the stuff about the flag, then he clearly does need to treat people how he’d want to be treated too but that doesn’t excuse the behaviour of Noel/Ignition really. Common courtesy is all that’s required. As much as I’m happy for rock stars to be vaginas, and actively want them to be, there’s also that line when it comes to impacting other people making a living and that shouldn’t be crossed really. |
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Post by andymorris on Apr 13, 2020 2:25:03 GMT -5
Well it seems kinda obvious why Noel vetoed, there's a nazi-like flag on it, he's big in Asia. Can they technically remove it (without it costing a lot of money, if it's like every shot of the guy) ? Not sure. But seems like this is the main reason. Then they should have told him that mate. Do feel for Mike in this instance. If he’s been ignoring the stuff about the flag, then he clearly does need to treat people how he’d want to be treated too but that doesn’t excuse the behaviour of Noel/Ignition really. Common courtesy is all that’s required. As much as I’m happy for rock stars to be vaginas, and actively want them to be, there’s also that line when it comes to impacting other people making a living and that shouldn’t be crossed really. I freelance too, and I dont see things like that. It's a business after all, and a release of this movie with no prior inspection of the content could have harmed Noel's business in Asia, deeply. Which is still a big market for aging rock stars. Or simply european rock stars. In the end, if that is really the reason for the film not being released, Ignition had every right to pull it, the filmmaker is responsible 100% of the content of the movie he is shooting, especially if he came up with the idea. + they have been collaborating on videos since Noel started his solo career, it's not like he didn't give his trust to the guy. He's done all videos for the first record, did Ride the Tiger short film. I mean, something big must have happened for it to fail. As big as a Nazi-like flag !  Looking rapidly at his director's history, that guy made a name on Noel. www.imdb.com/name/nm2751852/He does not have much before 2011 and NGHFB 1 videos. Noel benefited from it too, no questions, though. On a side note, i have not heard the podcast yet but i always take people's word carefully. As i said before, there's always two sides to every story. He apparently paid for it because he's got a producer credits, i doubt those things are not discussed, and therefore agreed by both parties, beforehand. |
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Post by bt95 on Apr 13, 2020 4:06:02 GMT -5
Then they should have told him that mate. Do feel for Mike in this instance. If he’s been ignoring the stuff about the flag, then he clearly does need to treat people how he’d want to be treated too but that doesn’t excuse the behaviour of Noel/Ignition really. Common courtesy is all that’s required. As much as I’m happy for rock stars to be vaginas, and actively want them to be, there’s also that line when it comes to impacting other people making a living and that shouldn’t be crossed really. I freelance too, and I dont see things like that. It's a business after all, and a release of this movie with no prior inspection of the content could have harmed Noel's business in Asia, deeply. Which is still a big market for aging rock stars. Or simply european rock stars. In the end, if that is really the reason for the film not being released, Ignition had every right to pull it, the filmmaker is responsible 100% of the content of the movie he is shooting, especially if he came up with the idea. + they have been collaborating on videos since Noel started his solo career, it's not like he didn't give his trust to the guy. He's done all videos for the first record, did Ride the Tiger short film. I mean, something big must have happened for it to fail. As big as a Nazi-like flag ! Looking rapidly at his director's history, that guy made a name on Noel. www.imdb.com/name/nm2751852/He does not have much before 2011 and NGHFB 1 videos. Noel benefited from it too, no questions, though. On a side note, i have not heard the podcast yet but i always take people's word carefully. As i said before, there's always two sides to every story. He apparently paid for it because he's got a producer credits, i doubt those things are not discussed, and therefore agreed by both parties, beforehand. I have no issues if that was the reason mate, but they should have let him know. Of course they needed to review the film and that's absolutely fine. The bit he paid for was an example of Noel having the idea to have the actors in the vid follow him around different bits of the tour and then film them, which Mike agree to. But then Mike had to put up the costs for venue fees etc, when it had been Noel's idea in the first place. Just little things but suppose they all add up. Whatever reason for not going ahead with the vid, all they had to do was let the bloke know. |
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Post by oasisunited on Apr 13, 2020 8:06:49 GMT -5
Isn't the most logical explanation that it took Mike Bruce 2 years to produce this film and Noel has already moved on from WBTM?. Noel notoriously doesn't linger on releases, on top of the fact that he hates music videos. It seems most likely that timing just didn't work out, as all the other issues could have been resolved, especially if there was money to be had. Tbf it doesn’t take much to give feedback during the process which he had been asking for. As someone who freelances for a living you rely on your clients to be keeping you updated as to what their intentions are if it’s work which is going to be taking your time (and money). They could have told him to stop. Also, doing stuff like make Mike pay for stuff out of his own pocket is out of line too. I’ll defend Noel/his team when I don’t think they’ve done wrong and are getting unfairly slated, but in this case all they had to do was offer a decent explanation and have some common courtesy it seems. Also, it was only over the course of seven months (from filming in Feb 2018 on that US tour Noel did through to Mike submitting the final film in October 2018). Totally. I didn't mean to come across as defending Noel, nor do I know why he didn't want to complete it. I was merely pointing out that he has a track record of moving on quickly from things if they don't come out in the moment, for whatever the reason (as others have mentioned, the AA debacle is exhibit A). However, I disagree that he has to offer a public explanation for it -- ultimately, it is his material and his choice whether or not to allow it to be used, regardless of the reason. The only person I suppose that he owes an explanation to is Mike Bruce and we are only getting one side of the story on that. |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5
Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5