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Post by mossy on Nov 28, 2011 8:24:34 GMT -5
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Post by GIMH on Nov 28, 2011 8:27:35 GMT -5
Would explain why Be Here Now did better on release in America than any other album did there. Give over Noel, you never cracked America as much as you wanted because you stuck so much coke up your nose that you thought 70 odd minutes for 11 tracks and a reprise was acceptable.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2011 8:35:35 GMT -5
Would explain why Be Here Now did better on release in America than any other album did there. Give over Noel, you never cracked America as much as you wanted because you stuck so much coke up your nose that you thought 70 odd minutes for 11 tracks and a reprise was acceptable. THIS!! a million times K+
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J-200
Oasis Roadie
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Post by J-200 on Nov 28, 2011 8:50:37 GMT -5
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Post by Rifles on Nov 28, 2011 10:10:22 GMT -5
This should be fun
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Post by RocketMan on Nov 28, 2011 10:14:39 GMT -5
it's not liams fault alone. noel was the big mouth in the press back then. liam was just liam.
oasis wasn't make to break the us market. the us public just don't get all this working class hero thing
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Post by howsoonisnow on Nov 28, 2011 10:20:58 GMT -5
It's ridiculous to say that now. I've read an itw on a book about the manchester music scene. Noel said the american don't get Oasis, it's too english, too working class. The way they don't move on stage, they don't get it, they've got the impression that it's not a real gig if the band don't jump. Noel also said in that itw that the American didn't like the way they speak, the way the insulted every other band (american band I suppose). So no, Liam not showing up at one gig + the mTV unplugged surely didn't helped, but Noel big mouth and just the personnality of the band didn't fit with the USA at the time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2011 10:21:09 GMT -5
He makes a fair point, but.....
There is no real way to definitely figure out why they failed in the US when compared to the UK. Coke most likely had a lot to with it. Oasis never played the media game like people wanted them to, and they suffered from that as well. Mostly, I think their distain for everyone other then themselves was the biggest turn off to most people.
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Post by allah on Nov 28, 2011 10:31:13 GMT -5
It's both their faults.
It's Liam's fault because of the behaviour (MTV Awards, going to buy a house instead of going on their biggest US Tour etc) and it's Noel's fault because the songs weren't there.
I also agree with Rifles, this thread will be fun, as the Noel and Liam fanboys throw shit at each other over the fence.
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Post by tomlivesforever on Nov 28, 2011 10:59:14 GMT -5
Be Here Now went in high because of the hype. The quality either wasn't there or it was buried under 25 guitar tracks. Liam, although he did need house, one would have thought he might of mentioned this at some point to Noel or the management. Errr...like before they were due to get on a plane. Noel walked out of the tour two thirds of the way through. Missed more gigs than Liam I think. Doesn't really sound like just Liam to me. Nothing like a bit of revisionist history Noel.
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Post by Lennon2217 on Nov 28, 2011 11:06:03 GMT -5
Would explain why Be Here Now did better on release in America than any other album did there. Give over Noel, you never cracked America as much as you wanted because you stuck so much coke up your nose that you thought 70 odd minutes for 11 tracks and a reprise was acceptable. It's all about context. Be Here Now was helped out big time by the previous success of Morning Glory. There was huge US anticipation for the release of Be Here Now which wasn't really there when Morning Glory came out in 1995. I'd much rather take the Morning Glory route, top 4 album, 4 million copies sold, 3 hit US singles than do what Be Here Now did, #2 in charts, a million sold, no real hit singles stateside, lackluster US tour. Liam's summer of 1996 antics definitely impacted Oasis in America. MTV Unplugged was a PR disaster and not what the company envisioned, Liam not showing up for the first dates on that September tour let fans down and his behavior at the MTV Music awards really set off journalists. The backlash started then and it never really stopped in America till this day. They were at their Zenith after Knebworth and Liam chose the worst possible path following it. Granted, having Be Here Now run 71 minutes long over 11 songs and a 6 minute radio edit of D'You Know What I Mean? didn't really help their cause in the summer of 1997. Nobody in America was playing 6 minutes singles. I guess Noel's gotta take the hit for that one. If Oasis was smart they should have tailored their singles for different markets. This was pre file sharing days so it was possible to dictate what people were exposed to before an album was released. Don't Go Away, Stand By Me or I Hope I Think I Know would have made excellent lead off singles for the American market. I guess the conclusion for both of them is, cocaine is a hell of a drug.
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Post by RocketMan on Nov 28, 2011 11:15:13 GMT -5
the fact that noel and liam were so rude helped them to be so big in the uk. i don't think it's just because of their bad behaviour that they didn't crack the us.
the whole britpop thing wasn't us compatible
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Post by howsoonisnow on Nov 28, 2011 11:17:53 GMT -5
Good post lennon2217 But Noel also left the tour. I can understand why american fan were fed up, Liam didn't showed up at the beggining of the tour, and Noel left before the end. It was a little bit the same things in France. France had countless canceled gigs. In 1997, 2000, and 2009. Noel wasn't even there for the 2000 shows. Add to that, french media don't care for rock n roll and don't understand Liam and Noel spirit, they prefer modesty. And you get why Oasis had lost popularity there over the years. They were very famous again in 2005 and 2008 and then Rock en seine happened. The Gallagher and France don't get along, just like the gallagher and the USA
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Post by Lennon2217 on Nov 28, 2011 11:31:32 GMT -5
the fact that noel and liam were so rude helped them to be so big in the uk. i don't think it's just because of their bad behaviour that they didn't crack the us. the whole britpop thing wasn't us compatible Rude behavior in the US can only be tolerated for so long. If a band is delivering the hits, a record label, the press and the consumer will put up with it. If a band's antics out shine the music, they will turn on you and migrate to another band to shift units. It's cold blooded but true.
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Post by Rifles on Nov 28, 2011 11:32:41 GMT -5
You definitely can't blame only Liam for them not catching on in the US. He was the lightning rod and sort of the fall guy because of his reputation, but the main reason they lost the US was their attitude. If they had shit on the media but embraced their fans, they would have been fine.
They came across as arrogant and rude and all the media hated them. All they had to do was show love for the fans and they would have been ok, but they did nothing to refute their reputation and it cost them. US fans don't have to be coddled, but they won't pay to see someone that they feel doesn't give a shit about them.
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Post by jason1977 on Nov 28, 2011 11:36:57 GMT -5
Wasnt be here supposed to be predicted to sell 400 k first week but ended up selling 152 k
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Post by RocketMan on Nov 28, 2011 12:14:28 GMT -5
Wasnt be here supposed to be predicted to sell 400 k first week but ended up selling 152 k yeah. mcgee also said that be here now will sell 20million copies ;D i think the whole oasis thing was just to big for a little indie label everybody was having the best time of their lives, nobody really managed the whole situation
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Post by songbirdsally on Nov 28, 2011 12:22:51 GMT -5
Wasnt be here supposed to be predicted to sell 400 k first week but ended up selling 152 k yeah. mcgee also said that be here now will sell 20million copies ;D i think the whole oasis thing was just to big for a little indie label everybody was having the best time of their lives, nobody really managed the whole situation if you think about it it's amazing Oasis got that big without any proper management and just because of their music! where as almost all the big artists today have major record labels and pr companies that invest millions in marketing and it's more about marketing than it is about music wether you get big or not
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Post by howsoonisnow on Nov 28, 2011 12:33:45 GMT -5
yeah. mcgee also said that be here now will sell 20million copies ;D i think the whole oasis thing was just to big for a little indie label everybody was having the best time of their lives, nobody really managed the whole situation if you think about it it's amazing Oasis got that big without any proper management and just because of their music! where as almost all the big artists today have major record labels and pr companies that invest millions in marketing and it's more about marketing than it is about music wether you get big or not Yeah but Oasis had the all package, amazing songs, amzing voice, charismatics leaders, brothers fight, attitude and great gigs. They were like every great rockn roll band in the history of the UK mixed in one. And when a band is that good, it'll be big. If no band had the same success since it's only because they're not as good. I really don't believe in the band who are great but not famous. With the internet, if there was somewhere a really great band, it'll be famous very fast. Oasis was just too great at the time, they needed the press 5 minutes and then the people took them to the next level.
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Post by RocketMan on Nov 28, 2011 12:35:13 GMT -5
yeah. mcgee also said that be here now will sell 20million copies ;D i think the whole oasis thing was just to big for a little indie label everybody was having the best time of their lives, nobody really managed the whole situation if you think about it it's amazing Oasis got that big without any proper management and just because of their music! where as almost all the big artists today have major record labels and pr companies that invest millions in marketing and it's more about marketing than it is about music wether you get big or not like i said. noel and liam were two real characters with attitude and big mouths. i don't think without their misbehaviour they would had made it so big. they sold themselves without a big marketing strategy.
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Post by howsoonisnow on Nov 28, 2011 12:40:54 GMT -5
if you think about it it's amazing Oasis got that big without any proper management and just because of their music! where as almost all the big artists today have major record labels and pr companies that invest millions in marketing and it's more about marketing than it is about music wether you get big or not like i said. noel and liam were two real characters with attitude and big mouths. i don't think without their misbehaviour they would had made it so big. they sold themselves without a big marketing strategy. It was mostly the songs, when you're famous for yourself, it gives you Pete Doherty, everyone knows him but nobody cares for his music because it's shit. It wasn't like that for Oasis at all, the Gallagher had big mouth, but their records were masterpieces. That's what make them that famous.
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Post by tomlivesforever on Nov 28, 2011 12:48:44 GMT -5
like i said. noel and liam were two real characters with attitude and big mouths. i don't think without their misbehaviour they would had made it so big. they sold themselves without a big marketing strategy. It was mostly the songs, when you're famous for yourself, it gives you Pete Doherty, everyone knows him but nobody cares for his music because it's shit. It wasn't like that for Oasis at all, the Gallagher had big mouth, but their records were masterpieces. That's what make them that famous. While i'd agree with you that Pete Doherty is a moron of the highest order, he most certainly can write a decent tune.
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Post by RocketMan on Nov 28, 2011 12:49:06 GMT -5
like i said. noel and liam were two real characters with attitude and big mouths. i don't think without their misbehaviour they would had made it so big. they sold themselves without a big marketing strategy. It was mostly the songs, when you're famous for yourself, it gives you Pete Doherty, everyone knows him but nobody cares for his music because it's shit. It wasn't like that for Oasis at all. nah. sure you need the songs and oasis had songs like live forever, wonderwall and don't look back in anger. but with all that fighting between noel and liam, blur and oasis, cancelled tours and stuff, you get even more attention. all of that is something for the tabloids. and with the tabloids in the back you promote your album even more. wonderwall was a huge hit, but it makes you even more successful when you've got a rough background and you've got something to say. lady gaga wouldn't sell so many records without all her crazy clothes and all that
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Post by Nyron Nosworthy on Nov 28, 2011 13:04:21 GMT -5
He continued: "The first gig was a 16,000-seat arena, and the singer's not turned up. That killed us stone dead in America. This is rock'n'roll. Would Johnny Rotten have gotten a house on the eve of an American tour? Keith Richards? John Lennon? You either want it or you don't, and I blame him for us never becoming as big in America as we were in England."
That'll be Johnny Rotten who disbanded the Sex Pistols live on stage in America then, after they made a complete arse of the tour.
Liam's behaviour was undoubtedly the straw that broke the camels back, but "you either want it or you don't," well sorry Noel but neither of you were particularly arsed about the US, preferring (understandably?) to get shitfaced on coke than play the game.
It's just more shit to throw at Liam - not that he doesn't do exactly the same to Noel. Getting a bit boring now as neither of them have anything interesting to say about each other.
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Post by SOULDIGGER on Nov 28, 2011 13:12:54 GMT -5
The only reason and its the ONLY reason why oasis never cracked America is because liam and noel weren't about to kiss anyones ass and try to save the world alla BONO and Chris Martin. They weren't polite and they didn't give a fuck about the "American guide lines to success".
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