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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 28, 2020 17:28:34 GMT -5
People forget quickly. 15 years ago his rape incident was huge huge huge news. It damaged his reputation immediately. Loss of so many sponsorship deals. It was disgusting the victim shaming his defense team was doing leading up to the trial. They have laws against that now in this country. He definitely felt the heat. He cut a deal with the victim. He would issue a public apology and admit he was wrong. He also paid her $2.5m. He got no trial and no risk of jail time. She also could never speak of it again. Just remember folks he admitted to rape. That can’t be forgotten. A man can be a husband. A father. A sports hero and a rapist all at the same time. The media and fan reaction is a little over the top praising a man we don’t really know off the court. The loving husband angle spoken by the media is puzzling. His wife filed for divorce from him twice over affairs. Once in 2003. The other in 2011. The one story we do know off the court is a terrible one. I feel bad for all the families involved in this crash and the terrible loss of life. Kobe is one of the few individuals I can name that somehow had a successful career after a high profile rape case. The other is Roman Polanski. His is even worse. It was a minor. How is it some men are damned to lose it all in the metoo era yet others get a pass? How do they pick and decide who goes down for the count and others are waived off? Nah man, he never admitted to raping her. 'Although I truly believe this encounter between us was consensual, I recognize now that she did not and does not view this incident the same way I did'That's basically a nice version of 'he-said, she-said' Look man, nobody is going to know if he really raped her or not (only him and her). All we know is that she was unwilling to testify and the case was dismissed. She then sued him in civil court, where they settled, which is where people think he paid her off. Bottom line, it wasn't a good look for him at all and I truly hope he didn't do it, but we'll never know. So no, it's inaccurate to label him a rapist. Adulterer? For sure. And honestly, who cares about if his wife filed for divorce (believe it was only in 2011...IIRC she stuck by his side through the whole case in '03)? Can couples not reconcile and be happy with each other? This 'over-the-top' media praise, well that's mainly coming from media members who actually do (or did) know the guy. He's done a lot of great work in the LA area and has raised a lot of money for charity and is a great family man (from the people that know him). He definitely wasn't perfect and that rape case was a terrible look, but he overcame fought his way back to the top. As far as Polanski goes, he was convicted and the only reason he dodged jail time is escaping to Switzerland. Correct me if I'm wrong but he's still wanted in the US to this day, right? Kobe's cased was 'waived off' because the girl refused to testify sooo.... Yeah he said, she said huh? She said stop. He said no. Hence that apology. You have to remember what Kobe and his lawyers did to her leading up the the trial date. They dragged her name and character through the mud for months on the nightly news. They victim shamed her over and over by painting her as a druggy, a whore and mentally unstable. These days you aren’t allowed to do that to rape victims. She didn’t want to be in the spotlight any longer of an extremely public trial. She was getting death threats at one point. Terrible position everyone put her in. Part of her not testifying was that Kobe had to issue that public apology. All the evidence and court documents are very damming to Kobe and his team. He knew he was gonna eventually lose the civil trial. But they believed better to pay millions than go to prison. Sadly he was right. I have a feeling if this incident happened today it would have ended much much worse for him. Yes Polanski is still wanted and can’t return to America without arrest. That hasn’t stopped half of Hollywood to continue to work with him and the academy to hand him an Oscar statue. His case is horrific. 13 year old girl. Drugged. Raped. Terrible. Shame on all those celebs for working with him the last 40 years.
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Post by lakerfan7 on Jan 28, 2020 20:56:13 GMT -5
Nah man, he never admitted to raping her. 'Although I truly believe this encounter between us was consensual, I recognize now that she did not and does not view this incident the same way I did'That's basically a nice version of 'he-said, she-said' Look man, nobody is going to know if he really raped her or not (only him and her). All we know is that she was unwilling to testify and the case was dismissed. She then sued him in civil court, where they settled, which is where people think he paid her off. Bottom line, it wasn't a good look for him at all and I truly hope he didn't do it, but we'll never know. So no, it's inaccurate to label him a rapist. Adulterer? For sure. And honestly, who cares about if his wife filed for divorce (believe it was only in 2011...IIRC she stuck by his side through the whole case in '03)? Can couples not reconcile and be happy with each other? This 'over-the-top' media praise, well that's mainly coming from media members who actually do (or did) know the guy. He's done a lot of great work in the LA area and has raised a lot of money for charity and is a great family man (from the people that know him). He definitely wasn't perfect and that rape case was a terrible look, but he overcame fought his way back to the top. As far as Polanski goes, he was convicted and the only reason he dodged jail time is escaping to Switzerland. Correct me if I'm wrong but he's still wanted in the US to this day, right? Kobe's cased was 'waived off' because the girl refused to testify sooo.... Yeah he said, she said huh? She said stop. He said no. Hence that apology. You have to remember what Kobe and his lawyers did to her leading up the the trial date. They dragged her name and character through the mud for months on the nightly news. They victim shamed her over and over by painting her as a druggy, a whore and mentally unstable. These days you aren’t allowed to do that to rape victims. She didn’t want to be in the spotlight any longer of an extremely public trial. She was getting death threats at one point. Terrible position everyone put her in. Part of her not testifying was that Kobe had to issue that public apology. All the evidence and court documents are very damming to Kobe and his team. He knew he was gonna eventually lose the civil trial. But they believed better to pay millions than go to prison. Sadly he was right. I have a feeling if this incident happened today it would have ended much much worse for him. Yes Polanski is still wanted and can’t return to America without arrest. That hasn’t stopped half of Hollywood to continue to work with him and the academy to hand him an Oscar statue. His case is horrific. 13 year old girl. Drugged. Raped. Terrible. Shame on all those celebs for working with him the last 40 years. Dude, we don't know any of that for sure. That's my point. Yeah, he said, she said. Of course he thinks it went one way and her another. Do you know how it went down? Were you there? Maybe she wanted it and changed her mind mid-way? I don't know because she never told us her side in a trial. And it's been 17 years so I don't remember all the details, but all I really recall is them saying she was very promiscuous as she had two other dudes DNA on her underwear and it was proven it was fairly recent. I feel that was kinda relevant to the defense presenting their case. I do remember her getting death threats and that is totally out of order. All in all, believe what you want. But he ain't a rapist dude. And I agree on Polanski. All I was saying is that he was supposed to go to jail but fled and took asylum. Crazy thing is his accuser has urged the the DA to drop all the charged on him.
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Post by sgtpeppr on Jan 28, 2020 21:56:21 GMT -5
Yeah he said, she said huh? She said stop. He said no. Hence that apology. You have to remember what Kobe and his lawyers did to her leading up the the trial date. They dragged her name and character through the mud for months on the nightly news. They victim shamed her over and over by painting her as a druggy, a whore and mentally unstable. These days you aren’t allowed to do that to rape victims. She didn’t want to be in the spotlight any longer of an extremely public trial. She was getting death threats at one point. Terrible position everyone put her in. Part of her not testifying was that Kobe had to issue that public apology. All the evidence and court documents are very damming to Kobe and his team. He knew he was gonna eventually lose the civil trial. But they believed better to pay millions than go to prison. Sadly he was right. I have a feeling if this incident happened today it would have ended much much worse for him. Yes Polanski is still wanted and can’t return to America without arrest. That hasn’t stopped half of Hollywood to continue to work with him and the academy to hand him an Oscar statue. His case is horrific. 13 year old girl. Drugged. Raped. Terrible. Shame on all those celebs for working with him the last 40 years. Dude, we don't know any of that for sure. That's my point. Yeah, he said, she said. Of course he thinks it went one way and her another. Do you know how it went down? Were you there? Maybe she wanted it and changed her mind mid-way? I don't know because she never told us her side in a trial. And it's been 17 years so I don't remember all the details, but all I really recall is them saying she was very promiscuous as she had two other dudes DNA on her underwear and it was proven it was fairly recent. I feel that was kinda relevant to the defense presenting their case. I do remember her getting death threats and that is totally out of order. All in all, believe what you want. But he ain't a rapist dude. And I agree on Polanski. All I was saying is that he was supposed to go to jail but fled and took asylum. Crazy thing is his accuser has urged the the DA to drop all the charged on him. the two lines highlighted contradict each other.
youve made your mind up without knowing the person or the details, which is kinda exactly what we're talking about... to me, it dont matter whether he did it or not, because it makes no impact on him as a player which is the only thing i admire or respect about the dude.
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 28, 2020 21:58:01 GMT -5
Yeah he said, she said huh? She said stop. He said no. Hence that apology. You have to remember what Kobe and his lawyers did to her leading up the the trial date. They dragged her name and character through the mud for months on the nightly news. They victim shamed her over and over by painting her as a druggy, a whore and mentally unstable. These days you aren’t allowed to do that to rape victims. She didn’t want to be in the spotlight any longer of an extremely public trial. She was getting death threats at one point. Terrible position everyone put her in. Part of her not testifying was that Kobe had to issue that public apology. All the evidence and court documents are very damming to Kobe and his team. He knew he was gonna eventually lose the civil trial. But they believed better to pay millions than go to prison. Sadly he was right. I have a feeling if this incident happened today it would have ended much much worse for him. Yes Polanski is still wanted and can’t return to America without arrest. That hasn’t stopped half of Hollywood to continue to work with him and the academy to hand him an Oscar statue. His case is horrific. 13 year old girl. Drugged. Raped. Terrible. Shame on all those celebs for working with him the last 40 years. Dude, we don't know any of that for sure. That's my point. Yeah, he said, she said. Of course he thinks it went one way and her another. Do you know how it went down? Were you there? Maybe she wanted it and changed her mind mid-way? I don't know because she never told us her side in a trial. And it's been 17 years so I don't remember all the details, but all I really recall is them saying she was very promiscuous as she had two other dudes DNA on her underwear and it was proven it was fairly recent. I feel that was kinda relevant to the defense presenting their case. I do remember her getting death threats and that is totally out of order. All in all, believe what you want. But he ain't a rapist dude. And I agree on Polanski. All I was saying is that he was supposed to go to jail but fled and took asylum. Crazy thing is his accuser has urged the the DA to drop all the charged on him. So what did he apologize for exactly? And to a lot of people. Mainly her and her family. You don’t issue a mass apology like that to the public if you didn’t do something really really wrong. That apology statement reads like an admission of guilt without saying he raped her. It’s more like date rape because she was into it at first and then said no when he tried to do anal and finish on her face. I know that is gross but that is what she said and he told police. You are getting the underwear facts wrong. The underwear from the night in question was given to police the next morning. It has his fresh DNA and sperm all over as well as her blood. No other males. For some reason they also wanted to test her underwear that she wore to the cops that morning. That wasn’t going to be evidence used in the trial. They were using it for some sort of baseline testing. It showed older male DNA and sperm. Wasn’t fresh. His defense team used those results (which were not going to be evidence) to paint her as a whore to the media. That is an absolutely horrible act. Plenty of well written articles talking through the case are still online. Disgusting reads.
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Post by sgtpeppr on Jan 28, 2020 22:07:18 GMT -5
Dude, we don't know any of that for sure. That's my point. Yeah, he said, she said. Of course he thinks it went one way and her another. Do you know how it went down? Were you there? Maybe she wanted it and changed her mind mid-way? I don't know because she never told us her side in a trial. And it's been 17 years so I don't remember all the details, but all I really recall is them saying she was very promiscuous as she had two other dudes DNA on her underwear and it was proven it was fairly recent. I feel that was kinda relevant to the defense presenting their case. I do remember her getting death threats and that is totally out of order. All in all, believe what you want. But he ain't a rapist dude. And I agree on Polanski. All I was saying is that he was supposed to go to jail but fled and took asylum. Crazy thing is his accuser has urged the the DA to drop all the charged on him. So what did he apologize for exactly? And to a lot of people. Mainly her and her family. You don’t issue a mass apology like that to the public if you didn’t do something really really wrong. That apology statement reads like an admission of guilt without saying he raped her. It’s more like date rape because she was into it at first and then said no when he tried to do anal and finish on her face. I know that is gross but that is what she said and he told police. You are getting the underwear facts wrong. The underwear from the night in question was given to police the next morning. It has his fresh DNA and sperm all over as well as her blood. No other males. For some reason they also wanted to test her underwear that she wore to the cops that morning. That wasn’t going to be evidence used in the trial. They were using it for some sort of baseline testing. It showed older male DNA and sperm. Wasn’t fresh. His defense team used those results (which were not going to be evidence) to paint her as a whore to the media. That is an absolutely horrible act. Plenty of well written articles talking through the case are still online. Disgusting reads. wasnt her blood on his shirt aswell? at least we all agree that the media and lawyers did a horrendous job...
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Post by Lennon2217 on Jan 28, 2020 22:15:56 GMT -5
So what did he apologize for exactly? And to a lot of people. Mainly her and her family. You don’t issue a mass apology like that to the public if you didn’t do something really really wrong. That apology statement reads like an admission of guilt without saying he raped her. It’s more like date rape because she was into it at first and then said no when he tried to do anal and finish on her face. I know that is gross but that is what she said and he told police. You are getting the underwear facts wrong. The underwear from the night in question was given to police the next morning. It has his fresh DNA and sperm all over as well as her blood. No other males. For some reason they also wanted to test her underwear that she wore to the cops that morning. That wasn’t going to be evidence used in the trial. They were using it for some sort of baseline testing. It showed older male DNA and sperm. Wasn’t fresh. His defense team used those results (which were not going to be evidence) to paint her as a whore to the media. That is an absolutely horrible act. Plenty of well written articles talking through the case are still online. Disgusting reads. wasnt her blood on his shirt aswell? at least we all agree that the media and lawyers did a horrendous job...
Yes I believe it was. Something happened and it turned ugly. You don’t apologize for that over a difference of opinion if it didn’t turn dark. You also don’t pay someone $2.5m for a misunderstanding or whatever Kobe said. That isn’t normal and easy to do. Bad stuff happened that summer in 2003. Bad bad stuff.
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Post by dampcottage on Jan 29, 2020 7:39:38 GMT -5
Regarding some of the points made here, if a person accused of rape decides that the best course of action is a multi million payoff, this immediately strikes me as wrong, as good as an admission of guilt. If the same case is brought against me, I don't have millions in order to make that payoff, do we really think it would result in the same outcome? Would I be able to continue with my career and day to day life without repercussions? No chance. I do remember when Pete Townshend was headline news and he said he would happily stand in the street and look every man, woman and child in the eye and defend himself from those accusations, when it's comes down to it who would you believe, the guy who looks you in the eye and defends himself or the guy who offers you money to be quiet? While I respect Kobe Bryant's ability on a basketball court, I have zero respect for him as a person, if you truly are innocent, prove it
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Post by lakerfan7 on Jan 29, 2020 16:51:45 GMT -5
Dude, we don't know any of that for sure. That's my point. Yeah, he said, she said. Of course he thinks it went one way and her another. Do you know how it went down? Were you there? Maybe she wanted it and changed her mind mid-way? I don't know because she never told us her side in a trial. And it's been 17 years so I don't remember all the details, but all I really recall is them saying she was very promiscuous as she had two other dudes DNA on her underwear and it was proven it was fairly recent. I feel that was kinda relevant to the defense presenting their case. I do remember her getting death threats and that is totally out of order. All in all, believe what you want. But he ain't a rapist dude. And I agree on Polanski. All I was saying is that he was supposed to go to jail but fled and took asylum. Crazy thing is his accuser has urged the the DA to drop all the charged on him. the two lines highlighted contradict each other.
youve made your mind up without knowing the person or the details, which is kinda exactly what we're talking about... to me, it dont matter whether he did it or not, because it makes no impact on him as a player which is the only thing i admire or respect about the dude.
Haha, fair enough. My point was you can't call him a rapist as he was never tried. Anybody can do as they please though.
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Post by lakerfan7 on Jan 29, 2020 17:00:34 GMT -5
Dude, we don't know any of that for sure. That's my point. Yeah, he said, she said. Of course he thinks it went one way and her another. Do you know how it went down? Were you there? Maybe she wanted it and changed her mind mid-way? I don't know because she never told us her side in a trial. And it's been 17 years so I don't remember all the details, but all I really recall is them saying she was very promiscuous as she had two other dudes DNA on her underwear and it was proven it was fairly recent. I feel that was kinda relevant to the defense presenting their case. I do remember her getting death threats and that is totally out of order. All in all, believe what you want. But he ain't a rapist dude. And I agree on Polanski. All I was saying is that he was supposed to go to jail but fled and took asylum. Crazy thing is his accuser has urged the the DA to drop all the charged on him. So what did he apologize for exactly? And to a lot of people. Mainly her and her family. You don’t issue a mass apology like that to the public if you didn’t do something really really wrong. That apology statement reads like an admission of guilt without saying he raped her. It’s more like date rape because she was into it at first and then said no when he tried to do anal and finish on her face. I know that is gross but that is what she said and he told police. You are getting the underwear facts wrong. The underwear from the night in question was given to police the next morning. It has his fresh DNA and sperm all over as well as her blood. No other males. For some reason they also wanted to test her underwear that she wore to the cops that morning. That wasn’t going to be evidence used in the trial. They were using it for some sort of baseline testing. It showed older male DNA and sperm. Wasn’t fresh. His defense team used those results (which were not going to be evidence) to paint her as a whore to the media. That is an absolutely horrible act. Plenty of well written articles talking through the case are still online. Disgusting reads. Bro it was SEVENTEEN YEARS AGO, forgive me if I can't remember every detail. The only thing I remember is that it never went to trial. Not sure why he apologized...maybe he felt bad by putting her in this position at all by cheating on his wife? Or maybe he did rape her and was sorry? I don't know. Nor do you. Only he knows he true intentions. It's been so long and he's obviously learned and grown from this by becoming a loving husband and a family man so why can't we just focus on that? But by all means, focus on the negatives. I'll choose to side with 95% of the world and celebrate the man and his accomplishments.
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Post by lakerfan7 on Jan 29, 2020 17:05:58 GMT -5
Regarding some of the points made here, if a person accused of rape decides that the best course of action is a multi million payoff, this immediately strikes me as wrong, as good as an admission of guilt. If the same case is brought against me, I don't have millions in order to make that payoff, do we really think it would result in the same outcome? Would I be able to continue with my career and day to day life without repercussions? No chance. I do remember when Pete Townshend was headline news and he said he would happily stand in the street and look every man, woman and child in the eye and defend himself from those accusations, when it's comes down to it who would you believe, the guy who looks you in the eye and defends himself or the guy who offers you money to be quiet? While I respect Kobe Bryant's ability on a basketball court, I have zero respect for him as a person, if you truly are innocent, prove it It wasn't a pay-off. It was a settlement. The criminal case was dropped. Civil suit was then filed. At that point, why sit there and have your personal, sordid sexual details be put out there for the all the public to hear and read about forever. Especially when your in a high profile profession. Any lawyer would advise you to settle and get on with your life. Remember in a civil trial, you're not 'guilty/not guilty'...you're found liable.
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Post by sgtpeppr on Jan 30, 2020 9:20:42 GMT -5
the two lines highlighted contradict each other.
youve made your mind up without knowing the person or the details, which is kinda exactly what we're talking about... to me, it dont matter whether he did it or not, because it makes no impact on him as a player which is the only thing i admire or respect about the dude.
Haha, fair enough. My point was you can't call him a rapist as he was never tried. Anybody can do as they please though. just to be clear, i never called him a rapist. i was just surprised certain media werent bringing it up, is all...
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