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Post by uǝɥʇɐǝɥ on Feb 9, 2016 17:33:26 GMT -5
I think Andy and Gem have their own heads. So, no.
He might have been responsible but he wasn't some kind of master of puppets.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2016 17:42:07 GMT -5
Wow! Nothing is worse than Soldier On. Well...  (Probably) All in the Mind Ain't Got Muffins Little James Love Like a Bomb Thank You for the Good Times The Meaning of Soul The Nature of Reality The Quiet Ones Those Swollen Hand Blues Won't Let You Down (considering Oasis tracks only) + Better Man She Is Love Hung In A Bad Place I Can See A Liar Put Yer Money Where Your Mouth Is A Quick Peep And certainly some others... |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2016 18:57:56 GMT -5
Without doubt Noel held some songs back on this album. It was a case of 'that will do' rather than making the best album possible. By the time they recorded DOYS Noel couldn't be arsed and just wanted that and the tour done. He knew he was going solo but just needed the reason. Picking a fight with Liam throughout the tour was a pretty good one as people buy it.. Exactly. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 23, 2016 19:56:40 GMT -5
Yes, he sabotage the album by putting on a song that's probably better than any solo work he's ever done, falling down.
Now the plan comes into view. Why save an instant hit for your solo career? Use it for the Oasis album you don't give a shit about. That Noel, always two steps ahead of us.
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Post by spaneli on Oct 23, 2016 20:03:02 GMT -5
I think Come on Outside not that great, also it would have been strange to have another song with almost the same chorus of TSOTL. I think it would have slipped perfectly at track six, a concise rocker after the "I'm Outta Time" balladry - and then you get plunged into Falling Down. That one swap would make the whole album massively better. "To Be Where's There's Life" should have been closer to the live version with guitars and then the first eight tracks would have been fucking massive. So close. Another hole in this whole theory. Noel suggested guitars on To Be Where there's Life rather than sitars. I believe there was an interview where Noel said, "I didn't think they should be there, but it wasn't my song" or something akin to that. So let's scratch one so-so track off of Noel's ledger. Also, I don't mind get off your high horse lady. I think it fits with the album and is a nice couplet with Falling Down. It's the one song that actually fits their concept of groove based tracks. And it was actually one of the better received songs by critics at the time. There are really only two back breaking tracks on Dig Out Your Soul: Ain't got nothin and the Nature of Reality. The rest imo, makes for an extremely solid album. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 23, 2016 20:14:11 GMT -5
After Let's all make believe, The boy with the blues must be the most overrated song on this forum. That or Flick Of The-oooh horns, how daring-Finger. I don't think any of those songs are overrated. People are just annoyed that two of them got dumped to b-sides or bonus tracks. You wanna talk overrated? How about Noel hyping up "Stop The Clocks" and "Record Machine" non stop between 2002 and 2008. They are both sadly average and don't match any of the descriptions Noel gave to them over the years.  Ehhhh, Boy with the Blues is overrated. I personally really like Soldier On as the final track. It's understated, well made, and one of Liam's finest moments. Boy with the Blues is cliche sappy drivel, sorry. The solo is bland. The melody is incomplete. The song itself is desperately trying to get to the chorus as soon as possible (which honestly, the chorus isn't that good or memorable just overly self repeating) because the verses are tepid at best. Yes, let's do a verse with one note piano hits. To me, ending with Boy with the Blues would have been the weakest, we don't take chances and we'll relegate ourselves to tawdry ballads, statement ever. It's a cop out. I can live with Dig Out Your Soul because it was trying something different, anything different. Boy with the Blues/Record Machine/Stop the Clocks= more of the same. The sound of a band out of lock step with the fact that it's not the 90s anymore. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2016 21:36:49 GMT -5
Am I the only one who thinks Falling Down is really overrated? It's a good song, without a doubt, but I prefer most of his solo work. (Not the biggest fan of that too)
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Post by World71R on Oct 23, 2016 22:50:31 GMT -5
I think it would have slipped perfectly at track six, a concise rocker after the "I'm Outta Time" balladry - and then you get plunged into Falling Down. That one swap would make the whole album massively better. "To Be Where's There's Life" should have been closer to the live version with guitars and then the first eight tracks would have been fucking massive. So close. Another hole in this whole theory. Noel suggested guitars on To Be Where there's Life rather than sitars. I believe there was an interview where Noel said, "I didn't think they should be there, but it wasn't my song" or something akin to that. So let's scratch one so-so track off of Noel's ledger. Also, I don't mind get off your high horse lady. I think it fits with the album and is a nice couplet with Falling Down. It's the one song that actually fits their concept of groove based tracks. And it was actually one of the better received songs by critics at the time. There are really only two back breaking tracks on Dig Out Your Soul: Ain't got nothin and the Nature of Reality. The rest imo, makes for an extremely solid album. Looking at it from this perspective, I think it would've been epic had they done the first eight tracks the same, then followed it with Come on Outside, I Believe in All, and Soldier On. Those three tracks closing out DOYS after a great eight-track run would've tied any loose ends and made everything complete imo. |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Oct 23, 2016 22:59:42 GMT -5
Bag It Up
The Turning
Waiting For The Rapture
The Shock of The Lightning
I'm Outta Time
Come On Outside (Liam vox)
Falling Down
To Be Where There Is Life (Fearless)
I Wanna Live In A Dream In My Record Machine (Liam vox)
Boy With The Blues
* Hidden track 5 min later...........Waiting For The Rapture (Noel acoustic)
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Post by spaneli on Oct 23, 2016 23:05:03 GMT -5
Another hole in this whole theory. Noel suggested guitars on To Be Where there's Life rather than sitars. I believe there was an interview where Noel said, "I didn't think they should be there, but it wasn't my song" or something akin to that. So let's scratch one so-so track off of Noel's ledger. Also, I don't mind get off your high horse lady. I think it fits with the album and is a nice couplet with Falling Down. It's the one song that actually fits their concept of groove based tracks. And it was actually one of the better received songs by critics at the time. There are really only two back breaking tracks on Dig Out Your Soul: Ain't got nothin and the Nature of Reality. The rest imo, makes for an extremely solid album. Looking at it from this perspective, I think it would've been epic had they done the first eight tracks the same, then followed it with Come on Outside, I Believe in All, and Soldier On. Those three tracks closing out DOYS after a great eight-track run would've tied any loose ends and made everything complete imo. I personally don't get the fascination with Come on Outside. To me, it's just average. Once again, I don't think there were many amazingly better options without breaking the congruity of the album. Would it have made DOYS slightly better? Maybe? But then we'd all be complaining about how Oasis played it safe again. Maybe it's because DOYS has just aged incredibly well for me, but with every passing year, the more I can live with the tracklisting. Considering that so many of Oasis' albums became worse over time, Dig Out Your Soul has been a welcomed changed. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 23, 2016 23:08:14 GMT -5
Bag It Up The Turning Waiting For The Rapture The Shock of The Lightning I'm Outta Time Come On Outside (Liam vox)Falling Down To Be Where There Is Life (Fearless) I Wanna Live In A Dream In My Record Machine (Liam vox)
Boy With The Blues
* Hidden track 5 min later...........Waiting For The Rapture (Noel acoustic)  Could you really imagine those two songs ending DOYS?  As safe as safe can get. I'd be disappointed if I went through this heavy grooved based album and then got to two typically placid ballads. |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Oct 24, 2016 7:48:32 GMT -5
Bag It Up The Turning Waiting For The Rapture The Shock of The Lightning I'm Outta Time Come On Outside (Liam vox)Falling Down To Be Where There Is Life (Fearless) I Wanna Live In A Dream In My Record Machine (Liam vox)
Boy With The Blues
* Hidden track 5 min later...........Waiting For The Rapture (Noel acoustic) Could you really imagine those two songs ending DOYS? As safe as safe can get. I'd be disappointed if I went through this heavy grooved based album and then got to two typically placid ballads. Compared to the way it actually did end, my way is a home run. Oasis was playing it safe for over 10 years at that point. I was and still am very disappointed by High Horse, Ain't Got Muffins and Nature of Reality. In 2008 Oasis needed their best players on the field. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2016 7:56:14 GMT -5
Could you really imagine those two songs ending DOYS? As safe as safe can get. I'd be disappointed if I went through this heavy grooved based album and then got to two typically placid ballads. Compared to the way it actually did end, my way is a home run. Oasis was playing it safe for over 10 years at that point. I was and still am very disappointed by High Horse, Ain't Got Muffins and Nature of Reality. In 2008 Oasis needed their best players on the field. Sorry man. Bonehead and Guigs had been gone for nearly a decade by this point. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2016 7:59:43 GMT -5
I don't think any of those songs are overrated. People are just annoyed that two of them got dumped to b-sides or bonus tracks. You wanna talk overrated? How about Noel hyping up "Stop The Clocks" and "Record Machine" non stop between 2002 and 2008. They are both sadly average and don't match any of the descriptions Noel gave to them over the years. Ehhhh, Boy with the Blues is overrated. I personally really like Soldier On as the final track. It's understated, well made, and one of Liam's finest moments. Boy with the Blues is cliche sappy drivel, sorry. The solo is bland. The melody is incomplete. The song itself is desperately trying to get to the chorus as soon as possible (which honestly, the chorus isn't that good or memorable just overly self repeating) because the verses are tepid at best. Yes, let's do a verse with one note piano hits. To me, ending with Boy with the Blues would have been the weakest, we don't take chances and we'll relegate ourselves to tawdry ballads, statement ever. It's a cop out. I can live with Dig Out Your Soul because it was trying something different, anything different. Boy with the Blues/Record Machine/Stop the Clocks= more of the same. The sound of a band out of lock step with the fact that it's not the 90s anymore. Going for different is pointless if the results are crap! There is no excuse for 3, maybe 4, of the tracks that made the cut on DOYS. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2016 8:06:17 GMT -5
It would have made perfect sense to have High Horse Lady, Ain't Got Nothin' and Those Swollen Hand Blues as b-sides. Boy with the Blues, I Believe in All, Record Machine (I like the HFB version but the production ruined that song, would love to hear Liam singing that) were better. If Ain't Got Nothin' wasn't good enough for a b-side / album track on DBTT, why should it be on DOYS?
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Post by Lennon2217 on Oct 24, 2016 8:08:44 GMT -5
It would have made perfect sense to have High Horse Lady, Ain't Got Nothin' and Those Swollen Hand Blues as b-sides. Boy with the Blues, I Believe in All, Record Machine (I like the HFB version but the production ruined that song, would love to hear Liam singing that) were better. If Ain't Got Nothin' wasn't good enough for a b-side / album track on DBTT, why should it be on DOYS? Much like SOTSOG, HC and DBTT, DOYS is a half cooked album. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 24, 2016 8:17:30 GMT -5
Ehhhh, Boy with the Blues is overrated. I personally really like Soldier On as the final track. It's understated, well made, and one of Liam's finest moments. Boy with the Blues is cliche sappy drivel, sorry. The solo is bland. The melody is incomplete. The song itself is desperately trying to get to the chorus as soon as possible (which honestly, the chorus isn't that good or memorable just overly self repeating) because the verses are tepid at best. Yes, let's do a verse with one note piano hits. To me, ending with Boy with the Blues would have been the weakest, we don't take chances and we'll relegate ourselves to tawdry ballads, statement ever. It's a cop out. I can live with Dig Out Your Soul because it was trying something different, anything different. Boy with the Blues/Record Machine/Stop the Clocks= more of the same. The sound of a band out of lock step with the fact that it's not the 90s anymore. Going for different is pointless if the results are crap! There is no excuse for 3, maybe 4, of the tracks that made the cut on DOYS. Well, it's not like I was saying that. I like DOYS. It's just down to saying that it's different, therefore it is good. I believe it's good on its own. I just don't believe the other tracks left off the album are inherently that much better. To me, they're extremely boring and safe. They're better because they're not on the album, rather than being good songs imo. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2016 8:26:18 GMT -5
Going for different is pointless if the results are crap! There is no excuse for 3, maybe 4, of the tracks that made the cut on DOYS. Well, it's not like I was saying that. I like DOYS. It's just down to saying that it's different, therefore it is good. I believe it's good on its own. I just don't believe the other tracks left off the album are inherently that much better. To me, they're extremely boring and safe. They're better because they're not on the album, rather than being good songs imo. I guess my feeling is that it is hard to listen to anything after Falling Down, because the general quality of the songs fall between abismal and poor. There are a few tunes left off the album that are better songs to begin with is all. Sure, they are "safe" or "by-the-book" late era Oasis tunes, but they would still be a more enjoyable listen then what is there at the end of DOYS. Maybe it's a case of the first half of the album being so good that I cannot view that back end as anything other than crap. If that's the case, then they should have mixed the tracks up a bit to avoid the obvious nose dive after Falling Down. The drop off from Falling Down to what comes after is like going from swimming in the ocean to swimming in a plastic kiddie pool in the backyard. It's shocking, even for late era Oasis. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 24, 2016 8:26:53 GMT -5
Could you really imagine those two songs ending DOYS? As safe as safe can get. I'd be disappointed if I went through this heavy grooved based album and then got to two typically placid ballads. Compared to the way it actually did end, my way is a home run. Oasis was playing it safe for over 10 years at that point. I was and still am very disappointed by High Horse, Ain't Got Muffins and Nature of Reality. In 2008 Oasis needed their best players on the field. Ending with two bland ballads isn't safe? Like I said, I personally really like Get off Your High Horse Lady. It doesn't sound like any other Oasis track. I think that's a good thing. We've been saying that Noel has shown no balls by playing it safe, but the second he does change it up a little by making a track like GOYHHL, then it's, well they should have had two ballads at the end (essentially, playing it safe again). For me, you saying that you think that two other tracks might have been is a, "Well, alright. that's your opinion." But saying that Oasis were playing it safe, so you're option is essentially safer than what they've been playing it before is, tepid. I mean, Boy with the Blues is same droning half baked ballad people were complaining about on HC. Why take a step back? Is RM that good of a song? Because it reminds of the same overly grandiose bland ballad as Let there be Love. For me, that's not home run. That sounds like a band that had a concept and then crapped out at the last second to what they've been doing for 10 years prior, and failing at. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 24, 2016 8:28:40 GMT -5
It would have made perfect sense to have High Horse Lady, Ain't Got Nothin' and Those Swollen Hand Blues as b-sides. Boy with the Blues, I Believe in All, Record Machine (I like the HFB version but the production ruined that song, would love to hear Liam singing that) were better. If Ain't Got Nothin' wasn't good enough for a b-side / album track on DBTT, why should it be on DOYS? By that logic, why would you have on RM and Boy with the Blues? Both weren't deemed good enough to appear on DBTT or as b-sides? It doesn't hold well, imo. |
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Post by Lennon2217 on Oct 24, 2016 8:28:53 GMT -5
Going for different is pointless if the results are crap! There is no excuse for 3, maybe 4, of the tracks that made the cut on DOYS. Well, it's not like I was saying that. I like DOYS. It's just down to saying that it's different, therefore it is good. I believe it's good on its own. I just don't believe the other tracks left off the album are inherently that much better. To me, they're extremely boring and safe. They're better because they're not on the album, rather than being good songs imo. I have the exact opposite opinion. The weak songs that did make the party (High Horse, Muffins, Reality) are "different" but they aren't exactly good either. It's prob been 6-7 years since I've listened to any of them. I do realize that Record Machine and Come On Outside aren't earth shattering but a Liam vocal would have improved both. Even those half cooked demos towers over the final versions of the stink bombs found on DOYS. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 24, 2016 8:33:18 GMT -5
Well, it's not like I was saying that. I like DOYS. It's just down to saying that it's different, therefore it is good. I believe it's good on its own. I just don't believe the other tracks left off the album are inherently that much better. To me, they're extremely boring and safe. They're better because they're not on the album, rather than being good songs imo. I have the exact opposite opinion. The weak songs that did make the party (High Horse, Muffins, Reality) are "different" but they aren't exactly good either. It's prob been 6-7 years since I've listened to any of them. I do realize that Record Machine and Come On Outside aren't earth shattering but a Liam vocal would have improved both. Even those half cooked demos towers over the final versions of the stink bombs found on DOYS. I personally believe, the only real changes that need to happen to DOYS are swapping sitars out for guitars on TBWTL, and taking off Nature of Reality. Let it rain Lennon2217 . Let it rain  |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2016 8:41:10 GMT -5
Let's take a gander at the last 4 tracks of late era Oasis albums... Heathen Chemistry
(Probably) All In The Mind
She Is Love
Born On A Different Cloud
Better Man | Don't Believe The Truth
Part Of The Queue
Keep The Dream Alive
A Bell Will Ring
Let There Be Love | Dig Out Your Soul
To Be Where There's Life
Aint Got Muffins
The Nature of Reality
Soldier On |
Thoughts? For me, DOYS has the worst two tracks (Muffins, Reality) found here by a wide margin. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2016 8:43:16 GMT -5
It would have made perfect sense to have High Horse Lady, Ain't Got Nothin' and Those Swollen Hand Blues as b-sides. Boy with the Blues, I Believe in All, Record Machine (I like the HFB version but the production ruined that song, would love to hear Liam singing that) were better. If Ain't Got Nothin' wasn't good enough for a b-side / album track on DBTT, why should it be on DOYS? By that logic, why would you have on RM and Boy with the Blues? Both weren't deemed good enough to appear on DBTT or as b-sides? It doesn't hold well, imo. Record Machine was supposed to be on it, but they couldn't get it right, and Noel and Liam had a arguement about Boy with the Blues how the song should end. |
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Post by spaneli on Oct 24, 2016 8:44:27 GMT -5
By that logic, why would you have on RM and Boy with the Blues? Both weren't deemed good enough to appear on DBTT or as b-sides? It doesn't hold well, imo. Record Machine was supposed to be on it, but they couldn't get it right, and Noel and Liam had a arguement about Boy with the Blues how the song should end. Again, a song you couldn't get right and another that doesn't have an ending??? |
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