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Post by megyesitomate on Feb 21, 2022 17:43:50 GMT -5
And we're both fucking close to the action as well. Scary stuff.
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Post by matt on Feb 21, 2022 18:19:40 GMT -5
Trying to find this on the news, but BBC are only interested in being a PR outfit for Boris Johnson and hyping up his dissolution of covid rules.
Beyond pathetic.
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Post by jezza2 on Feb 21, 2022 18:27:50 GMT -5
Putin ordering troops into Eastern Ukraine for "peacekeeping" reasons isn't a good sign.
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Feb 21, 2022 20:38:02 GMT -5
I am very confused as an American right now. Is an invasion happening or not? I see people denying that what is happening is an invasion.
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Post by girllikeabomb on Feb 21, 2022 21:31:48 GMT -5
I am very confused as an American right now. Is an invasion happening or not? I see people denying that what is happening is an invasion.
It's not being called an invasion yet by the US officially because Russia already had troops in Donetsk so it's a question of whether they are just increasing their troop numbers due to the heightened tensions or whether they are actually preparing to attempt to take over the Donbas region (or even the whole of Ukraine). I don't think there's any clarity on that so yeah, it's confusing.
Once you call it an invasion then lots of consequences follow -- including the end of any hope for a diplomatic solution -- and you can't turn that clock back.
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Feb 21, 2022 22:00:17 GMT -5
I am very confused as an American right now. Is an invasion happening or not? I see people denying that what is happening is an invasion.
It's not being called an invasion yet by the US officially because Russia already had troops in Donetsk so it's a question of whether they are just increasing their troop numbers due to the heightened tensions or whether they are actually preparing to attempt to take over the Donbas region (or even the whole of Ukraine). I don't think there's any clarity on that so yeah, it's confusing.
Once you call it an invasion then lots of consequences follow -- including the end of any hope for a diplomatic solution -- and you can't turn that clock back.
Thanks for the clarity. I saw a youtube streamer going over recent news and found a report of communication jamming in the area. So it might not be looking good for Ukraine.
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Post by girllikeabomb on Feb 21, 2022 22:22:45 GMT -5
It's not being called an invasion yet by the US officially because Russia already had troops in Donetsk so it's a question of whether they are just increasing their troop numbers due to the heightened tensions or whether they are actually preparing to attempt to take over the Donbas region (or even the whole of Ukraine). I don't think there's any clarity on that so yeah, it's confusing.
Once you call it an invasion then lots of consequences follow -- including the end of any hope for a diplomatic solution -- and you can't turn that clock back.
Thanks for the clarity. I saw a youtube streamer going over recent news and found a report of communication jamming in the area. So it might not be looking good for Ukraine.
Ugh. There are lots of conflicting reports on the ground, and disinfo from all sides, so it's hard to know what to believe right now. But the fear and uncertainty must be so awful for the civilians of Ukraine. Hoping they will be safe ...
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Post by settingson on Feb 21, 2022 23:15:16 GMT -5
Only if my wife finds out how much I've spent on vinyl recently.
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Post by Teotihuacan on Feb 22, 2022 5:39:51 GMT -5
Goodbye friends! It's been fun..
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Post by dampcottage on Feb 22, 2022 6:31:30 GMT -5
I felt then as I feel now, that the politicians who took us to war should have been given the guns and told to settle their differences themselves, instead of organising nothing better than legalised mass murder- Harry Patch
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Post by dampcottage on Feb 22, 2022 7:15:10 GMT -5
The influence which impels towards war today is the influence of capitalism. Every war now is a capitalist move for new markets, and it is a move capitalism must make or perish- James Connolly
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Post by welshylad on Feb 22, 2022 10:52:35 GMT -5
I never understand the need for war etc..
Like what is the point in Russia invading Ukraine? What are they trying to achieve?
Fucking daft
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Post by funhouse on Feb 22, 2022 11:21:07 GMT -5
Found this guy on Youtube recently. Short and precise summary+analysis on what's happened and what could happen going forward.
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Post by dampcottage on Feb 22, 2022 11:22:24 GMT -5
The great lie is that it is civilization, it's not civilized, it has been literally the most blood thirsty brutalizing system ever imposed on this planet, that is not civilization, that's the great lie- John Trudell
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Post by dampcottage on Feb 22, 2022 11:23:45 GMT -5
We are led by the least among us, the least intelligent, the least noble, the least visionary- Terence McKenna
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Post by russiangenius on Feb 22, 2022 14:34:18 GMT -5
I never understand the need for war etc.. Like what is the point in Russia invading Ukraine? What are they trying to achieve? Fucking daft Putin is almost 70 and he wants USSR back, he thinks Russia is a great empire and ex-USSR countries should feed Russians. He doesn't like Ukrainian government as Ukraine wants to be closer to western world. Are all Russians support Putin's actions? Hell no.
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Post by tiger40 on Feb 22, 2022 14:57:59 GMT -5
I never understand the need for war etc.. Like what is the point in Russia invading Ukraine? What are they trying to achieve? Fucking daft Yeah, I agree with you. I absolutely hate wars full stop.
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Feb 22, 2022 16:09:43 GMT -5
I never understand the need for war etc.. Like what is the point in Russia invading Ukraine? What are they trying to achieve? Fucking daft Maybe the ultimate goal is the reformation of the Soviet Union (or as close as they can manage)?
And honestly, it's not a bad idea if it improves the lives of the citizens. Many of the former soviet states are now forgotten and decaying and its peoples living standards massively declined following the dissolution of the soviet union. But of course, the price of raising those standards is the sacrifice of a little freedom. And obviously, attaining that system again won't be without bloodshed now that many of those former areas have a taste of sovereignty and will be unwilling to to join Putin's dream.
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Feb 22, 2022 17:48:04 GMT -5
I never understand the need for war etc.. Like what is the point in Russia invading Ukraine? What are they trying to achieve? Fucking daft Maybe the ultimate goal is the reformation of the Soviet Union (or as close as they can manage)? And honestly, it's not a bad idea if it improves the lives of the citizens. Many of the former soviet states are now forgotten and decaying and its peoples living standards massively declined following the dissolution of the soviet union. But of course, the price of raising those standards is the sacrifice of a little freedom. And obviously, attaining that system again won't be without bloodshed now that many of those former areas have a taste of sovereignty and will be unwilling to to join Putin's dream.
Are they decaying any more than they were at the end of the Soviet Union?
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Feb 22, 2022 18:14:58 GMT -5
Maybe the ultimate goal is the reformation of the Soviet Union (or as close as they can manage)? And honestly, it's not a bad idea if it improves the lives of the citizens. Many of the former soviet states are now forgotten and decaying and its peoples living standards massively declined following the dissolution of the soviet union. But of course, the price of raising those standards is the sacrifice of a little freedom. And obviously, attaining that system again won't be without bloodshed now that many of those former areas have a taste of sovereignty and will be unwilling to to join Putin's dream.
Are they decaying any more than they were at the end of the Soviet Union? From what I have seen of a small, but varied sample of resident opinion, yes. Some of these places are in absolute ruin. People having to live on a few dollars a day. Many if not most hold those years in high esteem and are unhappy with current living.
Granted, having never been to these areas myself, I am reliant on YouTube travel channels who tend to interview residents of these countries. The person filming/editing can of course control the narrative. So maybe they are leaving out most of the negative views towards the USSR. Though, I don't get that impression, for whatever that's worth.
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Feb 22, 2022 18:39:09 GMT -5
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Post by jezza2 on Feb 22, 2022 18:42:04 GMT -5
Are they decaying any more than they were at the end of the Soviet Union? From what I have seen of a small, but varied sample of resident opinion, yes. Some of these places are in absolute ruin. People having to live on a few dollars a day. Many if not most hold those years in high esteem and are unhappy with current living.
Granted, having never been to these areas myself, I am reliant on YouTube travel channels who tend to interview residents of these countries. The person filming/editing can of course control the narrative. So maybe they are leaving out most of the negative views towards the USSR. Though, I don't get that impression, for whatever that's worth.
What are we defining as Soviet countries? Are we talking about countries that were under soviet influence before World War II or after?
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Feb 22, 2022 18:44:25 GMT -5
Data will always trump anecdote. Thanks.
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Post by The Invisible Sun on Feb 22, 2022 18:46:04 GMT -5
From what I have seen of a small, but varied sample of resident opinion, yes. Some of these places are in absolute ruin. People having to live on a few dollars a day. Many if not most hold those years in high esteem and are unhappy with current living.
Granted, having never been to these areas myself, I am reliant on YouTube travel channels who tend to interview residents of these countries. The person filming/editing can of course control the narrative. So maybe they are leaving out most of the negative views towards the USSR. Though, I don't get that impression, for whatever that's worth.
What are we defining as Soviet countries? Are we talking about countries that were under soviet influence before World War II or after? I'd assume after, because in many of those interviews people reference the 60's-80's
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Post by The Escapist on Feb 22, 2022 18:47:30 GMT -5
If the Soviet Union had actually been based around worker Soviets, none of this would be happening.
Fucking Lenin. Knobhead.
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