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Post by davidjay on Dec 2, 2011 19:12:33 GMT -5
Been doing some research on the Definitely Maybe demos and thought people may be interested in the following bit of info. As we know, both the demo and Mix 1 of Columbia (kindly uploaded by BubbleDude earlier this year) feature these samples, only the first of which is retained in the album version: 1. Speech and a burst of laughter on the intro.
2. What sounds like a Hare Krishna-style chant on the outro (more prominent in Mix 1).
3. A male voice saying something along the lines of ‘Take away the noise of your song…like an ever flowing stream’ When I interviewed Anjali Dutt (who was the recording engineer on the Definitely Maybe sessions at Sawmills and Eden Studios) she mentioned that they may have originally cross-faded the backwards guitars on the original mix of Up in the Sky with the Indian sample ‘Mother take me into your arms etc’ from Columbia. You can read the interview here: www.oasis-recordinginfo.co.uk/?page_id=132I had (wrongly) assumed that this was an English translation of the mantra-like chant heard at the end of the song; however, Anjali has just confirmed that these are the actual words spoken at the start. I guess that the accent in which they are spoken and the competing guitar sounds make it difficult to decipher. But give it a listen from around 0.45 in the video below – it may take a couple of repeats, but suddenly it becomes clear (the first word is muffled, but at 0.53 you can hear him say ‘take me...’ etc). Anjali added that she recognises the chant on the outro, but doesn’t recall where it was sampled from. Many thanks to Anjali for taking the time to answer my questions on this. The demo and Mix 1 of the song also feature a disembodied voice on the outro saying things like ‘Take away the noise of your song’, which Paolo Hewitt says on p. 193 of his book Getting High:the Adventures of Oasis was sampled from the radio and deliberately slowed down. This speech is clearer than the first sample, but some words are looped and overlap – making them hard to hear. They are clearer on Mix 1 than the demo though. So I googled what I could hear and found the following. The voice at 4:08 says ‘[take] away... the noise of your songs; to the melody of your harps I will not listen.’ According to this page, this is from the Biblical Book of Amos. bible.cc/amos/5-23.htmThat line is then looped, over which is layered another sample of the same voice reading ‘Let justice roll down like waters, and righteousness like an ever-flowing stream’, which, according to this other page is also from the same book of the Bible. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Like_an_Ever_Flowing_Stream |
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Post by Bring It On Dan on Dec 3, 2011 2:57:38 GMT -5
That is some seriously extensive research and thinking for something that most people have never even thought about, dedication or what? k+
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Post by davidjay on Dec 3, 2011 8:14:10 GMT -5
Cheers. Glad it’s of interest. I’m just putting together an article with the above info in it. There’s one other main similarity between the demo and studio versions of the song I hope to describe, and I’ve copied below what I’ve got so far in case people have any comments on it...
Speaking to Channel 4 on the 10th anniversary of Definitely Maybe The Real People’s Tony Griffiths said that “The version of Columbia [on Definitely Maybe]... sounded exactly like some of the eight-track versions, so I’m not sure whether they took some of the eight-track versions and put it onto twenty-four track and embellished on it, I’m not really sure.”
I think that Griffiths may have been referring to the fact that some of the samples from the demo discussed above were also used in an early studio version of the song, as well as on Owen Morris’s final mix. But all three versions also feature a deep, almost spoken backing vocal at several points.
I mention this because I’m not sure that it’s Noel. I’d be happy to proven wrong on this, but I recall reading that Liam initially found it hard to sing with headphones on. Chris Griffiths helped him get used to it by singing the song himself, which Liam would then sing along to. Then they would remove Chris’s vocal, leaving just Liam’s. (The Real People talk about this 9:10 into this video: )
Maybe the backing vocal on Columbia is actually Griffiths’ guide vocal? I’m not entirely convinced myself, but would be interested to hear what people think. You can hear the backing in these videos at the following points...
Columbia – White Label Demo
2:24: ‘This is confusion/Am I confusing you?’
2:44: ‘This is confusion/we don’t want to fool YOU’
3:15: ‘This is peculiar/we don’t want to fool YOU’
3:30-3.34: This is peculiar/we don’t want to fool you’ (sounds very different from Noel to me)
3:53 (same again)
Columbia – Mix 1
(The same backing vocals listed above can be heard at 3:02, 3:10, 3:20, and 3:30)
Columbia (album version)
(those backing vocals are also heard in Owen Morris's mix at 2:50, 2:59, 3:08, and 3:17)
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Post by Swarfiga on Dec 3, 2011 8:39:45 GMT -5
Interesting! K+
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Post by mkoasis on Dec 3, 2011 13:55:28 GMT -5
That is some seriously extensive research and thinking for something that most people have never even thought about, dedication or what? k+ Well said. I enjoyed reading about your investigation! K+ |
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Post by Heebeejeebies on Dec 8, 2011 4:17:19 GMT -5
Thanks so much for that info! I've always wondered about those samples!
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Post by underneaththesky on Dec 8, 2011 15:41:13 GMT -5
nice one, mate!
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Post by matt on Dec 8, 2011 15:47:31 GMT -5
Wow, as shakeyourragdoll says this is dedication! Really interesting read and one of the best Oasis songs ever. In my personal top three Oasis tunes.
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Post by mossy on Dec 8, 2011 18:34:26 GMT -5
Wow, everyday is a school day!
I always thought the sample at the beginning was Liam shouting nonsense off mic !
I think you're right - the backing vox don't sound like Liam or Noel
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Post by davidjay on Feb 2, 2012 11:29:45 GMT -5
I recently heard a bootleg (Oasis - The Early Years) on YouTube which seems to feature a slightly different mix of the Columbia demo (which can be heard at 35:40 in the video below)
The main difference I can hear is that the speech samples are louder (particularly the Bible-reading one at the end), making it easier to hear some of the words. I now think the sample at the start of the song (35:55) says:
‘I’ve seen so much to disgust mother, take me into your arms…how am I to protect you?’.
(It’s hard to hear but I think it’s either ‘discuss’ or ‘disgust’ at the start, but the latter somehow makes more sense to me. Would be good to find out where this comes from…same goes for the mantra-style chant at the end).
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Post by beadyeyeunofficial on Feb 4, 2012 13:15:55 GMT -5
In a single thread, you've made all of Oasis's songs uncool. I hope you're pleased with yourself.
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Post by gdforever on Feb 4, 2012 13:38:03 GMT -5
Interesting read. Thanks
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Post by davidjay on Feb 4, 2012 15:16:38 GMT -5
In a single thread, you've made all of Oasis's songs uncool. I hope you're pleased with yourself. I’m just researching how the song was produced; all I can say is that if you don’t like that kind of information, then please don’t waste your time reading it. I welcome constructive criticism, if you have any. |
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Post by gdforever on Feb 4, 2012 15:33:26 GMT -5
In a single thread, you've made all of Oasis's songs uncool. I hope you're pleased with yourself. IÂ’m just researching how the song was produced; all I can say is that if you donÂ’t like that kind of information, then please donÂ’t waste your time reading it. I welcome constructive criticism, if you have any. He's a troll back after a little hiatus ignore him. |
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Post by spaneli on Feb 4, 2012 15:55:34 GMT -5
Thanks for all the infor and all the hard work. Great read as usual.  |
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Post by beadyeyeunofficial on Feb 7, 2012 11:32:02 GMT -5
IÂ’m just researching how the song was produced; all I can say is that if you donÂ’t like that kind of information, then please donÂ’t waste your time reading it. I welcome constructive criticism, if you have any. He's a troll back after a little hiatus ignore him. I've always been here...I've never left! Mwuahahahahahahaha!!! If you can't remember me being here, then reality really is a strange thing, isn't it? It's your word against mine, and while I've been here I've slowly eroded the faith in your ability to tell the truth...Mwuahahahahahahaha!!! No-one believes you any more, I've managed to expose you as the fraud that you really are... How do you know I wasn't really here? Can you remember everything? Can you remember what you had for lunch yesterday? Can you remember who you walked past in the street five years ago to the day? Memory is subjective. How do you even know I've posted before? I could be a part of your brain, nagging away, nagging away, nagging away...until you go clinically insane. Mwuahahahahahahaha!!! How can you even remember? Everything we claim to remember is probably just something we've fabricated in order to win a particular point and gain credence with another person. For example, you've just told a total lie to try and become friendly with davidjay. A total lie. Lies. Lies. Lies. Lies. They make the world spin around, unless you have worked out the conspiracy. I've worked out the conspiracy. And I can see through you. And you don't get it. |
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Post by Bring It On Dan on Feb 7, 2012 16:41:50 GMT -5
Beadyeyeunofficial > everyone else
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Post by kennerado on Feb 10, 2012 20:59:53 GMT -5
The White Label demo is my favorite version of this track and the origin of the samples always bugged the hell out of me, especially the chant at the end, cool thread. Thanks for the info.
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Post by davidjay on Mar 4, 2012 15:35:08 GMT -5
I recently contacted the Real People’s manager, who kindly forwarded a Q&A to Tony and Chris Griffiths about their work with Oasis on the Live Demonstration sessions. Thought it may be of interest on this thread as there’s some more info on the Columbia demo and several other tracks: www.oasis-recordinginfo.co.uk/?page_id=544 |
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Post by Teotihuacan on Mar 4, 2012 15:49:22 GMT -5
^ I've been finding theses updates fascinating and after reading the McCarroll book a few weeks ago was very interested in The Griffiths' take on the early period since McCarroll gives them what seems to be very generous credit on early Oasis material, so sincere thanks for this and the other info.
The info about scanning a live radio broadcast and mixing it into the Columbia demo, I believe this was probably suggested by John Lennon doing the same thing on the outro of I Am The Walrus.
It sounds like Noel tried to do it again at the very end of the instrumental Track 11 on Morning Glory there's some static and then you hear a random song from the radio broadcast they were tuning into.
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Post by truefaith on Mar 4, 2012 15:55:24 GMT -5
^ I've been theses updates fascinating and after reading the McCarroll book a few weeks ago was very interested in The Griffiths' take on the early period since McCarroll gives them what seems to be very generous credit on early Oasis material, so sincere thanks for this and the other info. I've read McCarroll's book too. I don't believe everything he said since he obviously hate Noel. But I belive given all different itw over the years that The Griffiths have given Noel and Liam a direction. They help them find their way, Noel as songwritter and Liam as a singer. Liam didn't sound so good on early demos and Noel early material sounds like The Stone Roses. The Reallis have helped them develop their style, they suremy had a big impact on Oasis. And then, there's the sharing credit for Rock in chair, the stolen line of one of their song in Don't Go Away and the fact that they co wrote Columbia's lyrics with Liam. |
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Post by rw1980 on Mar 7, 2012 7:02:00 GMT -5
The male voice is Tony Benn. Happy to help.
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Post by davidjay on Mar 7, 2012 8:10:19 GMT -5
The male voice is Tony Benn. Happy to help. Thanks and welcome to the forum, rw1980. Yes, Chris Griffiths confirms this in the interview linked to above. The voice was vaguely familiar to me but I couldn't put a name to it! I guess the radio broadcast from which it was sampled may have been of a reading he did of his diaries for BBC Radio 4 in the early 90s, which were later published as an audiobook called The Benn Tapes. |
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Post by davidjay on Oct 24, 2014 16:38:57 GMT -5
I noticed some of the videos on this old thread are no longer available, so I put together three YouTube clips highlighting each sample from the demo of Columbia, with subtitles where possible (i.e. on all bar the chant). Btw the audio here is sourced from an out-of-phase (OOPS) stereo version of the White Label demo, kindly provided by Tom S. This helps make the vocal samples much clearer than on the original master.
Sample 1
Sample 2
Sample 3
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Post by supernovadragon on Oct 25, 2014 2:59:12 GMT -5
I noticed some of the videos on this old thread are no longer available, so I put together three YouTube clips highlighting each sample from the demo of Columbia, with subtitles where possible (i.e. on all bar the chant). Btw the audio here is sourced from an out-of-phase (OOPS) stereo version of the White Label demo, kindly provided by Tom S. This helps make the vocal samples much clearer than on the original master. Sample 1Sample 2Sample 3Thank you for all this information and the new youtube videos |
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Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5
Nov 4, 2024 5:04:30 GMT -5