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Post by oasisserbia on Sept 22, 2019 11:45:08 GMT -5
Those saying it sounds like Gary Barlow or Bryan Adams wrote it are hillarious. You guys should seriously consider getting into stand up comedy. So funny. Or we can make some shit 90s sitcom for teens because we have perfect opening theme for it
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Post by GlastoEls on Sept 22, 2019 11:46:55 GMT -5
Those saying it sounds like Gary Barlow or Bryan Adams wrote it are hillarious. You guys should seriously consider getting into stand up comedy. So funny. Or we can make some shit 90s sitcom for teens because we have perfect opening theme for it They said that about She’s Electric in 1995.
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Post by oasisserbia on Sept 22, 2019 11:48:39 GMT -5
Well, both songs are shit. But at least that was Noel in his prime, so his shit song was still 7/10 song.
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Post by GlastoEls on Sept 22, 2019 11:49:17 GMT -5
Well, both songs are shit. But at least that was Noel in his prime, so his shit song was still 7/10 song. Neither are shit!
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Post by freddy838 on Sept 22, 2019 11:49:27 GMT -5
Why do people sort accept this truth of Liam being a bad songwriter and without help it would go to shit? He's wrote some great songs and some fillers in Oasis. Not really anything shit(?) The same with the songs for his solo debut. If he didnt have songwriting help on his first album, stuff like Eh La would have had to go on it, which is possibly one of the worst songs I've ever heard. This was after having a long break without releasing anything too, so he would probably have had even less material for this one. That's not to mention that I'm sure stuff like I've All I Need had help from someone. Probably Dan who helped him with the original demos in the early stages IIRC. It sounds like Liam still writes stuff but then gets help on it, which is how it should have always been with Oasis (and no doubt was helped by Gem, Andy, Noel and even Johnny Marr on HC).
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Post by neila83 on Sept 22, 2019 11:51:34 GMT -5
I don't see the contradiction. You can think both that the song-writing in Beady Eye was poor, and that songs like Shockwave and Once sound a bit manufactured. I think they're both valid criticisms, in fact. That's not the argument they are making. They're simply shifting the authenticity goalposts back and forth. Claiming WMWN is overproduced doesn't carry the automatic implication that the solution was to do it all himself, except in the arguments being advanced by those people. It's a spin-off of Noel's own quote from back in 2012: "I think he should put his name in lights and go for it". Well, he did it. And now it's "Adele through a tin box". I think it's naive to think that certain members of this forum wouldn't be in here lamenting the songwriting if Liam released an entirely self-written record. There's no need to wonder, really. We had two Beady Eye albums of entirely in-group songwriting and low-key production. Arguments in favor of having someone "mentor" Liam were put forth absolutely-sincerely-don't-you-ever-doubt-it-old-son by some of the usual suspects. Well, he accepted mentoring and went to #1 twice in a row. But oh, no! Now he's not being true to himself and should just write his own material! Ultimately, these people's argument is "his songwriting is not to my taste, and I don't approve of his working with Oscar-winning songwriters and producers, so he should just not do anything". If they just said "I'm off Liam, can't be bothered to listen to anything he does", we could save a lot of time presently being wasted in sanctimonious posting. No, that's not their argument, and completely twisting what people have said to shut down the debate is rather disingenuous. What many have consistently said is that they don't so much mind Liam working with songwriters, it's the kind of people he works with. There's a big difference between him hiring Adeles songwriters, and working with say, the Chemical brothers. One is a credible artist that has some of the same spirit and ethos as Liam supposedly has. The other is a soulless corporate machine designing songs to appeal to their focus groups. You can hear it in the music. It's not just about authenticity. If Liam was singing a rock song written by Primal scream, or something more electronic by the Chemical team brothers the song is going to be a lot better than someone not from that genre trying to imitate it. Greg Kurstin just writes whatever style he's told to write for max commercial appeal. It wouldn't surprise me if he's giving Liam songs rejected by other artists, or that he never wrote specifically for Liam. Which makes the music completely souless to me. I think plenty would be happy with Liam having a couple of his own on an album, and collaborating for the rest. I, refuse to believe there aren't plenty of great artists who would love to have his voice on a track. But it would make less money, so there you go. Anyway, a lot of Oasis fans are apparently happy with it and are happy to hear Liams voice autotined to oblivion for the rest of his career. I mean, what is the point of Liam Gallagher in that case?
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Post by Dangerman on Sept 22, 2019 11:58:39 GMT -5
Well, both songs are shit. But at least that was Noel in his prime, so his shit song was still 7/10 song. This post says it all really. I am now enlightened. Thank you.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 12:02:56 GMT -5
I don’t really care how little or how much Liam has written on this album. I do, however, wish it was more transparent. He’s actually pretty gifted when it comes to ideas, I’d like to see these explicitly revealed and rightfully applauded.
Also, if he wants to include the likes of Alright Now and NTIFY on his album this is also fine, “buy it don’t buy it” but he shouldn’t continue to call himself a rock n roll star if he’s putting out these kinda tunes (which I’m absolutely certain he didn’t write).
This album had an origin of 6, not too difficult to guess which ones they were.
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Post by ricardogce on Sept 22, 2019 12:07:21 GMT -5
No, that's not their argument, and completely twisting what people have said to shut down the debate is rather disingenuous. What many have consistently said is that they don't so much mind Liam working with songwriters, it's the kind of people he works with. There's a big difference between him hiring Adeles songwriters, and working with say, the Chemical brothers. So, shifting the goalposts. Exactly as I said. The Chemical Brothers have no more artistic credibility than a songwriter who's won a bloody Oscar for his songwriting. That's your subjective opinion masquerading as objective fact. "Spirit" is in the ear of the beholder. Acknowledging that instead of trying to force personal judgement as empirical fact would be more honest. More subjective argument posing as objective fact. I hear Lennon, Harrison, and on the outside, a bit of 70s Daltrey. Exactly the kind of music Liam's leaned on forever. By claiming Liam working with a heretofore unnamed songwriter other than those "soulless" ones you don't approve of would make less money, you're doing two things: 1. You introduce the accusation that it's all about the money, without needing to prove that unnamed songwriter X would have less commercial appeal. Nice. 2. You retain the ability to shift the goalposts again later, because you haven't named songwriter X, so no matter who Kurstin or Wyatt might be hypothetically replaced with, you can trot out the same argument. And there's the cherry on top: When out of arguments, move away from the point being argued and juist throw in an ad-hominem. The sheer cheek of you of all people taking issue with what I said, my god. You're the embodiment of every empty, dishonest argument in this community.
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Post by pliolite on Sept 22, 2019 12:22:36 GMT -5
Misunderstood sounds completely written by Simon Aldred.
Though I now see it says it's him and Liam. Liam probably threw in a couple of lines.
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Post by thomaslivesforever on Sept 22, 2019 12:24:58 GMT -5
Why do people sort accept this truth of Liam being a bad songwriter and without help it would go to shit? He's wrote some great songs and some fillers in Oasis. Not really anything shit(?) The same with the songs for his solo debut. No one has said he’s shit. He’s just not prolific and struggles with structure and choruses all of which he has said himself. He was helped with these things in Oasis, he was helped we these things in Beady Eye and now he’s being helped with these things as a solo artist.
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Post by elephantstone93 on Sept 22, 2019 12:29:50 GMT -5
Funny people on here slagging off NTIFY but outside of this forum to me eyes at least it's gone down brilliantly. Some weird agendas on this forum.
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Post by pliolite on Sept 22, 2019 12:34:24 GMT -5
Shockwave - Liam, Wyatt, Kurstin One of Us - Liam, Wyatt Once - Liam, Wyatt NTIFY - Liam, Aldred Halo - Liam, Kurstin, Wyatt WMWN - Liam, Aldred Be Still - Liam, Kurstin, Wyatt Alright Now - Liam, Wyatt, McMahon Meadow - Liam, Kurstin, Wyatt The River - Liam, Wyatt Gone - Liam, Wyatt, Tighe Invisible Sun - Liam, Wyatt Misunderstood - Liam, Aldred Glimmer - Liam. Wyatt, Tighe, Alex and Constantin Veis
I'd guess Simon Aldred wrote the chorus for WMWN and Liam wrote the rest. Glimmer's credits are interesting...no clue who those other 2 people are. Maybe it samples their song or something? Halo being a Kurstin song doesn't surprise me one bit, as it's so keyboard-based, and right up his street!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 12:45:25 GMT -5
Why does the live version have hundreds of thousands more views than the original.
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Post by emil on Sept 22, 2019 12:47:28 GMT -5
Why does the live version have hundreds of thousands more views than the original. People have other ways to listen to a studio version of a song than youtube.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 12:47:39 GMT -5
Do people know what autotune is?
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Post by Dangerman on Sept 22, 2019 12:48:31 GMT -5
I don’t really care how little or how much Liam has written on this album. I do, however, wish it was more transparent. He’s actually pretty gifted when it comes to ideas, I’d like to see these explicitly revealed and rightfully applauded. Also, if he wants to include the likes of Alright Now and NTIFY on his album this is also fine, “buy it don’t buy it” but he shouldn’t continue to call himself a rock n roll star if he’s putting out these kinda tunes (which I’m absolutely certain he didn’t write). This album had an origin of 6, not too difficult to guess which ones they were. I dunno, I think he can still call himself rock and roll. I don't he loses that entitlement 'cos he's turned his hand to a few softer numbers. Shockwave, Halo, WMWN, Be Still, The River and Gone all have a certain attitude and are pretty rockin'.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 12:50:30 GMT -5
Why does the live version have hundreds of thousands more views than the original. People have other ways to listen to a studio version of a song than youtube. I figure most people will listen on youtube a few times. I don't usually see the difference being that big.
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Post by Dangerman on Sept 22, 2019 12:53:04 GMT -5
Liam has always somebody elses songs. I don't know why it bothers people so much. It’s bothering because it’s vague. For instance in the sleevenotes for blur records you had detailed info like « song: authors » « lyrics : authors » « music (eg the instrumental parts) : people » To me this is the fairest and most interesting way of crediting people. As you said we can hear some Liam in those songs, but hey maybe those guys copied his style (they can clearly copy anything) and Liam did nothing or so little. When you’re passionate about something you wanna know how it’s done, what was the inspiration, what were the struggles, did it come naturally or did they work hard on a part... etc it goes beyond just the listening experience. It’s trying to get a grasp of the whole process. Maybe I’m a music nerd but I can’t stop reading about those things and for Liam, there’s little to no infos about anything that makes me think sometimes he did not contribute anything. He probably did, but on what level ? Did he come up with once but was stuck for the chorus ? Did he wake up one day and thought about a particular line on a song ? The why me why not anecdote is interesting there’s probably more. So why not do a track by track review of his album? On as you were it was clearer because most songs where his. No debate. Fair. Not sure its entirely a question of passion though. Are you suggesting that people who aren't bothered aren't passionate about music?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 12:54:52 GMT -5
Just go on youtube or wiki and look at the performance credits.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 12:55:14 GMT -5
I don’t really care how little or how much Liam has written on this album. I do, however, wish it was more transparent. He’s actually pretty gifted when it comes to ideas, I’d like to see these explicitly revealed and rightfully applauded. Also, if he wants to include the likes of Alright Now and NTIFY on his album this is also fine, “buy it don’t buy it” but he shouldn’t continue to call himself a rock n roll star if he’s putting out these kinda tunes (which I’m absolutely certain he didn’t write). This album had an origin of 6, not too difficult to guess which ones they were. I dunno, I think he can still call himself rock and roll. I don't he loses that entitlement 'cos he's turned his hand to a few softer numbers. Shockwave, Halo, WMWN, Be Still, The River and Gone all have a certain attitude and are pretty rockin'. They definitely are, and yeah, suppose I should’ve said the songs I mentioned aren’t rock n roll. I’m just frustrated I guess, coz to me the ones you speak of are some of the best on the album, along with Invisible Sun.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 12:56:30 GMT -5
He wrote a few oasis singles, even a number 3 song. Pretty decent song writer.
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Post by andymorris on Sept 22, 2019 12:59:55 GMT -5
Fair. Not sure its entirely a question of passion though. Are you suggesting that people who aren't bothered aren't passionate about music? Absolutely not, just that we're not looking for the same thing in music. Some people just want tunes sung by Liam Gallagher, and i'm fine that. I prefer artists who do it all ( mostly songwriting related, not talking about producing). As I said i enjoy this record, but it will never be on the same level as anything from someone spent months, nights trying to come up with a good melody, or Idea, as a whole, from beginning to end, sweating in the studio, at home.. etc. It's a pop record from someone was previously known as Liam Gallagher. Taken like that, it's the best it could have been.
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Post by shannee on Sept 22, 2019 13:09:16 GMT -5
Those saying it sounds like Gary Barlow or Bryan Adams wrote it are hillarious. You guys should seriously consider getting into stand up comedy. So funny. Or we can make some shit 90s sitcom for teens because we have perfect opening theme for it So funny you said that, my so yesterday, who LIKES this song and the whole album btw, says it’s sounds like a theme song from an 80s sitcom with a pair of buddies, one with a crazy mustache, who are always getting into scrapes and high jinks. I was like, Jesus Christ, it does! 😂
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Post by martinpaul on Sept 22, 2019 13:37:58 GMT -5
Liam is and always has been happy to give others credit for helping him write songs. Noel on the other hand has other people help him write songs (since 1993) but HAS to be the sole songwriter on the credits for his ego.
Twas ever thus
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