|
Post by globe on Dec 13, 2019 8:48:02 GMT -5
It's a small crumb of comfort living in Scotland and thoroughly rejecting the Tories and Brexit but we'll go down with the UK Brexit Titanic. Get ready for austerity like never before and the poor and ill to be absolutely destroyed. 😦😦 Mate, just you watch. These Tory kunts will try to hammer us now.
|
|
Howdo
Oasis Roadie
Listen kids, i'd rather walk!
Posts: 477
|
Post by Howdo on Dec 13, 2019 9:09:10 GMT -5
UK leaving EU was one thing, but so many people voted for Tory was an another thing. I have great English friends and their first child was just born early this year. I really feel like his aunt myself and I don't wish him to grow up in the world which was run by idiots. US and UK, two of the biggest countries of the world have such clowns as the President and PM, what a shame. The US and the UK have been the cause of most of the troubles we have in the world dating back through time, it's all about control and power. It's all about the rich countries getting richer and the poor countries getting poorer and then they are the first ones to moan when immigration happens, people are fleeing from poor countries because the rich countries have made them like that. It'll only get worse i'm afraid. I've never been into politics and that before but i've kept my eye on things after the referendum and it's quite sad and after watching some John Pilger documentaries about democracy it really does open your eyes about what's going on in the world and it's not a pretty place. All politicians are as bad as each other, they just have different puppet masters!
|
|
|
Post by mancraider on Dec 13, 2019 9:17:25 GMT -5
As an Englishman living in scotland who never supported independence previously,hoping, obviously naively, that the working classes would come together to defeat the criminals in Westminster, all I can say after last night is - f*ck the English.
Still think there are major problems that will come with independence but it has to happen. There is going to be major violence on the streets if Johnson tries to block it.
|
|
|
Post by The Escapist on Dec 13, 2019 15:50:16 GMT -5
The most bizarre thing about all this is the working-class people you get replying to anyone left-of-centre online with all that "cry more, liberal", or "I love drinking your tears" shite. I don't even really know how I'd explain it. It's just weird.
|
|
|
Post by batfink30 on Dec 13, 2019 15:57:25 GMT -5
The most bizarre thing about all this is the working-class people you get replying to anyone left-of-centre online with all that "cry more, liberal", or "I love drinking your tears" shite. I don't even really know how I'd explain it. It's just weird. It's bonkers, they're literally voting to impoverish themselves and cut services they rely on. 🤷♂️🤷♂️
|
|
|
Post by The Escapist on Dec 13, 2019 16:01:50 GMT -5
The most bizarre thing about all this is the working-class people you get replying to anyone left-of-centre online with all that "cry more, liberal", or "I love drinking your tears" shite. I don't even really know how I'd explain it. It's just weird. It's bonkers, they're literally voting to impoverish themselves and cut services they rely on. 🤷♂️🤷♂️ But there's this weird, twisted culture war they seem to believe they're fighting. They're not just happy that politics they believe in is happening, they want to "crush" or "own" or "DESTROY" the people who want something different. I have about 99 theories on why that might be the case, but even still, you think they'd read it back when they type it out and think "Actually, that makes me sound a bit strange, there".
|
|
|
Post by mkoasis on Dec 14, 2019 1:32:15 GMT -5
It's bonkers, they're literally voting to impoverish themselves and cut services they rely on. 🤷♂️🤷♂️ But there's this weird, twisted culture war they seem to believe they're fighting. They're not just happy that politics they believe in is happening, they want to "crush" or "own" or "DESTROY" the people who want something different . I have about 99 theories on why that might be the case, but even still, you think they'd read it back when they type it out and think "Actually, that makes me sound a bit strange, there". There’s a real nasty tribal savagery these days that’s just growing and growing this decade.
|
|
|
Post by globe on Dec 14, 2019 7:12:17 GMT -5
I see that wee fud Tommy Robinson has now joined the Conservative Party. Found his natural home.
|
|
|
Post by RocketMan on Dec 14, 2019 7:38:25 GMT -5
UK leaving EU was one thing, but so many people voted for Tory was an another thing. I have great English friends and their first child was just born early this year. I really feel like his aunt myself and I don't wish him to grow up in the world which was run by idiots. US and UK, two of the biggest countries of the world have such clowns as the President and PM, what a shame. Try "racist, authoritarian sociopaths who consider themselves above the rule of law". Thinking of them as silly and comedic only helps them grow. Thats true. Hitler was considered a joke until it was too late.
|
|
|
Post by The Escapist on Dec 14, 2019 9:18:13 GMT -5
How the Commons would have looked with Proportional Representation. Don't take seriously any analysis of the Tory "landslide" that doesn't acknowledge the role our electoral system played in engineering it.
|
|
|
Post by mancraider on Dec 14, 2019 9:50:02 GMT -5
The most bizarre thing about all this is the working-class people you get replying to anyone left-of-centre online with all that "cry more, liberal", or "I love drinking your tears" shite. I don't even really know how I'd explain it. It's just weird. seen plenty of stories on twitter about people not even knowing what they voted for. One woman who had an autistic child voted Con because of Brexit then was in tears after it was pointed out that the Tories were going to defund services her kid relied on. It was literally in their manifesto but she hadn't read it. Others blaming Labour for homelessness, bedroom tax and not funding the NHS. Its terrifying the amount of ignorance that exists. Of course it's not an accident. This is what happens when extreme poverty and lack of education meets the sewer of lies that is the British media.
|
|
|
Post by mancraider on Dec 14, 2019 14:06:19 GMT -5
The most bizarre thing about all this is the working-class people you get replying to anyone left-of-centre online with all that "cry more, liberal", or "I love drinking your tears" shite. I don't even really know how I'd explain it. It's just weird. seen plenty of stories on twitter about people not even knowing what they voted for. One woman who had an autistic child voted Con because of Brexit then was in tears after it was pointed out that the Tories were going to defund services her kid relied on. It was literally in their manifesto but she hadn't read it. Others blaming Labour for homelessness, bedroom tax and not funding the NHS. Its terrifying the amount of ignorance that exists. Of course it's not an accident. This is what happens when extreme poverty and lack of education meets the sewer of lies that is the British media. see also... Spoke with a friend earlier she asked me if happy with the Election result, I said No , she asked why and explained she "voted for Boris, as Corbyn would have taken us out of the EU!' - We are not talking. She thought Get Brexit Done meant remaining. 🤦♀️🤬🤬🤬😭 WTAF!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2019 14:40:09 GMT -5
My view is that it ceased to be about the EU the day the pEoPLe'S vOtE movement started to gain traction. It became a London-centric, mostly middle class group of people trying to deny the democratic vote of people who, in many cases, probably would've just shrugged their shoulders and got on with their lives had they lost the referendum. But they won and the establishment tried to take it away. The culmination of decades of Labour taking their votes for granted. It could have been a referendum about bus timetables or the cost of Freddos and the same thing would ultimately have happened.
In hindsight, the only way to stop this was a relatively sensible Brexit (Norway Plus or something). Remaining was never achievable democratically and now we get a crazed Tory Brexit instead.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2019 14:41:08 GMT -5
seen plenty of stories on twitter about people not even knowing what they voted for. One woman who had an autistic child voted Con because of Brexit then was in tears after it was pointed out that the Tories were going to defund services her kid relied on. It was literally in their manifesto but she hadn't read it. Others blaming Labour for homelessness, bedroom tax and not funding the NHS. Its terrifying the amount of ignorance that exists. Of course it's not an accident. This is what happens when extreme poverty and lack of education meets the sewer of lies that is the British media. see also... Spoke with a friend earlier she asked me if happy with the Election result, I said No , she asked why and explained she "voted for Boris, as Corbyn would have taken us out of the EU!' - We are not talking. She thought Get Brexit Done meant remaining. 🤦♀️🤬🤬🤬😭 WTAF! I've seen quite a few reports of voters in the traditional Labour heartlands genuinely not understanding that having a Labour MP doesn't mean that you have a Labour government, and voting Tory for change. ffs.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2019 15:14:01 GMT -5
Correct. For all the "leftist Labour must die" takes we're gonna get from smug Guardian writers over the next few days, the policy that killed them in this election was the one centrist position they took in backing a People's Vote. I've only seen a short video of John McDonnell talking about it but you can tell he's filled with guilt. He got sold a pup by people who don't understand people outside their bubble at all and tbh don't want to. I voted to remain, accepted the result, reluctantly got on board with the eventual Labour confirmatory referendum position, but we were wrong. The genie was out of the bottle. I still don't have an argument for a Leave voter who asks why they should acquiesce to a new referendum. What we can't do now is lurch back to unprincipled centrism. There's nothing in Thursday's results that calls for that. The manifesto is brilliant and, while I'd dial back on some of the things that are difficult to communicate in a short conversation, the new leader should be committing to the majority of it.
|
|
|
Post by matt on Dec 14, 2019 15:31:17 GMT -5
The most bizarre thing about all this is the working-class people you get replying to anyone left-of-centre online with all that "cry more, liberal", or "I love drinking your tears" shite. I don't even really know how I'd explain it. It's just weird. It would be interesting to talk to these people face to face instead of them hiding behind an avatar to uncover the root of such behaviour. In all seriousness, they can’t be of sound wellbeing and mentality with that kind of flippant, unsympathetic attitude. And the question you have to ask is why are people behaving like that? I wouldn’t be surprised if many of these individuals are in decimated communities. Decades of societal upheaval incurs emotional trauma on many and takes away the capacity for patience, sympathy and empathy, which creates a fertile environment for nationalism and racism. All the old communitarian ways of living destroyed by free markets, deindustrialisation and with it a sense of place, pride and identity. You will get people who are naturally conscientious and inevitably resist such upheaval in their community to do the good thing, but in any vulnerable and traumatic environment, it’s to be expected that many will succumb to negative impulse and emotion that overrides logic and rationality. The old adage of ‘tore the heart from the community’ sounds like a cliche but it’s true. Strong community, worthwhile jobs and strong social capital with its civic institutions and supportive welfare state is the foundation of a healthy democracy. I’m genuinely at a loss, the things that were perceived wisdom just don’t seem to get through to anyone now.
|
|
|
Post by The Escapist on Dec 14, 2019 15:47:17 GMT -5
The most bizarre thing about all this is the working-class people you get replying to anyone left-of-centre online with all that "cry more, liberal", or "I love drinking your tears" shite. I don't even really know how I'd explain it. It's just weird. It would be interesting to talk to these people face to face instead of them hiding behind an avatar to uncover the root of such behaviour. In all seriousness, they can’t be of sound wellbeing and mentality with that kind of flippant, unsympathetic attitude. And the question you have to ask is why are people behaving like that? I wouldn’t be surprised if many of these individuals are in decimated communities. Decades of societal upheaval incurs emotional trauma on many and takes away the capacity for patience, sympathy and empathy, which creates a fertile environment for nationalism and racism. All the old communitarian ways of living destroyed by free markets, deindustrialisation and with it a sense of place, pride and identity. You will get people who are naturally conscientious and inevitably resist such upheaval in their community to do the good thing, but in any vulnerable and traumatic environment, it’s to be expected that many will succumb to negative impulse and emotion that overrides logic and rationality. The old adage of ‘tore the heart from the community’ sounds like a cliche but it’s true. Strong community, worthwhile jobs and strong social capital with its civic institutions and supportive welfare state is the foundation of a healthy democracy. I’m genuinely at a loss, the things that were perceived wisdom just don’t seem to get through to anyone now. To take the big picture, I think we're seeing the beginning of the end of capitalism in the west. It's good points - the rapid raising of living standards and fast creation of economy - have been moved to the east, where it's currently in the same stage it was in Dickensian England, with child labour and vast wealth creation contrasted against appalling poverty. What this means for the west, is, as you say, the death of community. Even the death of hope. Life expectancy is shortening, government service is being cut, the environment is dying, and I think for young men there's a sense of being part of a lost generation. When this kind of economic deterioration occurs, there's three possible reactions. The first is state socialism, which we saw in Russia in the 20th century. This is clearly a bad idea, and is quite unlikely given the lingering propaganda of the Cold War. The second (and best) would be the creation of a co-operative sector. Funded initially by government, we could see the formation of worker co-operatives wherein the decisions of what to produce, where and how to produce it, and what to do with the profits were made democratically by those involved, perhaps with some degree of local community involvement. If you take the Mondragon co-operative in Spain, they have rules that managers are hired and fired by the workers, and the highest earner is never paid more than eight times more than the lowest. This is the solution, in my eyes. The third reaction, though, and the one that doesn't threaten the top-down nature of our society, is nationalism. With all it's toxic masculinity, racism, regression, and nostalgia. With all it's disregard for compassion, and it's emphasis on victory above all else. Unfortunately, that seems to be what is happening, and on a much larger scale than just edgy Twitter trolls.
|
|
|
Post by The Escapist on Dec 17, 2019 16:49:48 GMT -5
Manufacturing consent.
|
|
|
Post by globe on Dec 18, 2019 16:24:35 GMT -5
We need out of the EU to get away from these unelected bureaucrats!
BTW we are giving the unelected Nicky Morgan a seat in the House of Lords and making her Culture Secretary.
|
|
|
Post by mimmihopps on Jan 31, 2020 2:16:28 GMT -5
This isn't end.
|
|
|
Post by globe on Jan 31, 2020 5:56:49 GMT -5
One day, Scotland will rejoin.
|
|
|
Post by dampcottage on Jan 31, 2020 7:19:15 GMT -5
One day, Scotland will rejoin. sooner rather than later hopefully, when your chance of independence comes along again please don't fuck it up 😋
|
|
|
Post by batfink30 on Jan 31, 2020 8:22:00 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Beady’s Here Now on Jan 31, 2020 11:37:40 GMT -5
Brexit Day and Trump’s Acquittal essentially on the same day.
|
|
|
Post by matt on Feb 1, 2020 6:59:37 GMT -5
#
'Dear lord, what a sad and pathetic country'.
|
|