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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 18, 2008 20:21:39 GMT -5
I think most of you are over looking what is a brilliant lyric The more I think about it, the more I come to the conclusion that that line is ace Rumor has it that if you dream that you're dying then you're going to die in your sleep (pretty hard to prove, hence it's a myth and not fact). Thus, if you're "living a dying dream" then your experience that you're having in life is so bad it's comparable to death.....So I know what "he means" That line, while not as good as POTQ's "Every beginning has broken it's promise", is up there with it due to the somewhat subtle content. Brilliant. Noel has done it again.
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Post by thuperthonic on Aug 18, 2008 20:33:38 GMT -5
i've never died in a dream. i don't think it's possible. wtf would happen after you died? you wouldn't be able to do or think anything, you'd be dead.
regardless, yes, it's quite an evocative lyric and i like it.
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Post by bwilder on Aug 18, 2008 20:36:21 GMT -5
"Every beginning has broken its promise" is a really good fuckin lyric...
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Post by quellophant on Aug 18, 2008 20:37:08 GMT -5
I really like this but sometimes don't full understand Noel's lyrics. Is this about a failed hope or something or is he aiming for something more spiritual than that do you think? The album is supposedly full of holy references! I never got that POTQ lyric though, it sounds really good and catchy, like all of Noel's lyrics, but what exactly does it mean?
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Post by supersonic1983 on Aug 18, 2008 20:47:21 GMT -5
Brilliant. Noel has done it again. Stage One: Noel cobbles together shite lyric. Stage Two: live4evr hears shite lyric. Stage Three: live4evr 'deciphers' shite lyric as though it were lifted straight from the desk of William Wordsworth. They're just basic songwriting phrases. They're not philosophy.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 18, 2008 20:51:16 GMT -5
I really like this but sometimes don't full understand Noel's lyrics. Is this about a failed hope or something or is he aiming for something more spiritual than that do you think? The album is supposedly full of holy references! I never got that POTQ lyric though, it sounds really good and catchy, like all of Noel's lyrics, but what exactly does it mean? A beginning to something/anything is meant to be promising with the hope of success. You get a new job which is a new beginning - you expect something good to come from it. You move cities and expect something good from this new beginning too - new friends, etc. So forth and so on. So if a "beginning has broken its promise" it means the promise of hope, the promise of success, etc. Instead of the "beginning" being good, it turned out bad, and bleak. It's a genius way of saying "every new thing I try, it still ends up as poorly as what I've previously done" As for your Falling Down inquiry, I think it's about failed hope (and not necessarily religious hope at that). I don't see anything positive in that song (but perhaps you can ask ugottahavefun, that numb nut thought Fade Away was about positivity!). Remember, Noel is an antheist, and he's shown that in previous songs too (Idlers Dream - "I wish I could pray but it's just no good", Carry Us All - "Faith in any God will only bury us all" etc) He's done the same here with "I tried to talk to God but to no avail." It's an easy, but also good way for Noel to convey his point - normally one of hopelessness. So while the song does have a religious lyric in it, I don't think the content is about religion and hope/faith in God, but rather faith in oneself (or, in this case, lack there of....)
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 18, 2008 20:55:17 GMT -5
Brilliant. Noel has done it again. Stage One: Noel cobbles together shite lyric. Stage Two: live4evr hears shite lyric. Stage Three: live4evr 'deciphers' shite lyric as though it were lifted straight from the desk of William Wordsworth. They're just basic songwriting phrases. They're not philosophy. We're not talking about Coldplay. "Those who are dead are not dead they're just living in my head" - 100% crapness I would like to say "end of" but I can't. VLV is filled with shite lyrics "Just cos I'm hurting doesn't mean I'm hurt" - Erm....it does....You can't even twist that line around, he's trying to be clever, but fails. "You might be a big fish in a little pond" - Cliche Now, one or two cliche's are fine, but not a whole song worth as well (see song Viva La Vida) There's probably a lot more lyrical problems in that album, but those are the ones I recall from the top of my head - I'm not going to "research" it just to prove my point even further. So I'm suprised you somehow find fault with Falling Down ("I tried to talk to God but to no avail....I said 'if you're not going to save me, then don't waste my time' ) when your other favorite band - Coldplay - has failed to even live up to Noel's "poor" (in your mind) standard.
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Post by supersonic1983 on Aug 18, 2008 21:03:50 GMT -5
I'm not talking about Coldplay. You can't seem to fucking stop.
A cliche is a cliche is a cliche, regardless of who it's written by. I'm not having a pop at Noel - I'm just saying that perhaps you're dressing his lyrics up as something that they're not.
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Post by Beady’s Here Now on Aug 18, 2008 21:15:11 GMT -5
I'm not talking about Coldplay. You can't seem to fucking stop. A cliche is a cliche is a cliche, regardless of who it's written by. I'm not having a pop at Noel - I'm just saying that perhaps you're dressing his lyrics up as something that they're not. Well it seems like most people glossed over the "dying dream" line, whether they admit it or not.....so before people start accusing Falling Down of having shit lyrics - and I've seen a few people already have done so - I think they better understand the meaning of the lines before jumping to any sort of conclusion. Clearly if you understood that line, you'll realize it's not bad, coupled with the God couplet in the chorus and the Noelism pinch from the poem referencing "catch the wheel" and you got a pretty damn clever bit of song writing going on there....
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Post by supersonic1983 on Aug 18, 2008 21:24:15 GMT -5
It's alright, I suppose, but I'm firmly of the opinion that Noel's a fairly lazy lyricist, and find it difficult to believe that lyrics such as those in Falling Down and The Shock Of The Lightning are any more than superficial phrases which just happened to fit the melody.
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Post by Rifles on Aug 18, 2008 22:30:02 GMT -5
I think most of you are over looking what is a brilliant lyric Brilliant. Noel has done it again. "We live a dying dream, if you know what i mean..."Yeah we're sure overlooking that gem of a lyric. You're reading into these things wayyyyyyy too much. Noel can write some great lyrics, but the fact that you just left out the 2nd half of that line says it all really.
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Post by TheEXPERIENCE on Aug 18, 2008 22:30:39 GMT -5
You want a brilliant lyric from Falling Down?
I tried to speak to God, to no avail... ...I said if you won't save me, please don't waste my time
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Post by supersonic1983 on Aug 18, 2008 22:38:12 GMT -5
I don't think it's asking too much to expect a bit more effort from a man who's responsible for having written lyrics to songs like Live Forever, Acquiesce, The Masterplan, and Cast No Shadow. Do you?
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Post by desidiosus on Aug 18, 2008 22:52:23 GMT -5
I looked it at it as him living his dream as a Rockstar was fading (maybe due to age?) and him being a Rockstar is all that hes ever known
Just my take on it >_>
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Post by romain696 on Aug 18, 2008 23:06:07 GMT -5
I'm feelin Supersonic, give me gin and tonic
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Post by oasis6 on Aug 18, 2008 23:10:40 GMT -5
K this may sound weird, but ive died in dreams many times. I can remember them so clearly. Or maybe I'm like a second from dying. But ive had dreams where ive been shot, stabbed, fallen off a building, mauled by a monster, etc... I remember dying in the dream, then always waking up right away. Is something wrong with me.
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Post by checkwithmemum on Aug 18, 2008 23:17:54 GMT -5
Well it seems like most people glossed over the "dying dream" line, whether they admit it or not.....so before people start accusing Falling Down of having shit lyrics - and I've seen a few people already have done so - I think they better understand the meaning of the lines before jumping to any sort of conclusion. And you, with the linguistical skills of an infant, are going to give them that understanding... EPIC FAIL If you want Oasis's music to be appreciated as art rock then go ahead and tear it to shreds, but last time I checked it was out and out Rock 'N' Roll, which is best listened to and not overanalysed. Just listen to the song, sing-a-long and leave it at that.
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Post by mape on Aug 18, 2008 23:30:23 GMT -5
"Those who are dead are not dead they're just living in my head" - 100% crapness I would like to say "end of" but I can't. VLV is filled with shite lyrics "Just cos I'm hurting doesn't mean I'm hurt" - Erm....it does....You can't even twist that line around, he's trying to be clever, but fails. "You might be a big fish in a little pond" - Cliche if Noel had written those you'd be soiling your pants in excitement.
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Post by The Boy Without the Blues on Aug 18, 2008 23:50:24 GMT -5
The lines are great but it's pretty OBVIOUS that Noel couldn't care less about, they fit in the song and that's it... he always use some abstract lines that can be interpreted with a deep meaning that i doubt the chief himself even bother to think...
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2008 23:55:48 GMT -5
You want a brilliant lyric from Falling Down? I tried to talk to God, to no avail... ...I said if you won't save me, please don't waste my time Yeh, those are the best lines in the song. They fit together very well.
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Post by thuperthonic on Aug 19, 2008 0:30:48 GMT -5
K this may sound weird, but ive died in dreams many times. I can remember them so clearly. Or maybe I'm like a second from dying. But ive had dreams where ive been shot, stabbed, fallen off a building, mauled by a monster, etc... I remember dying in the dream, then always waking up right away. Is something wrong with me. you don't actually die though, do you. you wake up just before. so that's what i'm saying, i don't think it's possible for anyone to actually die in a dream. you always wake up just before. but yeah, something's wrong with you lol
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costello
Oasis Roadie
Like a catfish dancin' on a line in a groovy kind of style
Posts: 361
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Post by costello on Aug 19, 2008 0:41:57 GMT -5
Noel doesn't spend so much time on his lyrics, while you do... The keys of the universe are not in his lyrics, it just happends that they rhyme, are good fun and fit perfectly with Liam's voice " Time, shine, dream, scream, light, sky, bright, cloud, loud " etc...
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Post by henrod89 on Aug 19, 2008 3:39:02 GMT -5
It's alright, I suppose, but I'm firmly of the opinion that Noel's a fairly lazy lyricist, and find it difficult to believe that lyrics such as those in Falling Down and The Shock Of The Lightning are any more than superficial phrases which just happened to fit the melody. I totally agree. People on this board look way too much into his lyrics and even Liam's lyrics at times. Trust me, he doesn't think about it anywhere near as much as Notorious or anyone else searching for a meaning. Noel does write great lines. And I'm not saying that he puts no thought into his lyrics whatsoever. But I really doubt that he sits there and just thinks out his words/lines that much. As a songwriter, a lot of times you just write down words because they sound good together and they somewhat make sense. Sure, you'll have your songs that just come together perfectly and make great sense. But other times the lyrics just somewhat make sense but they sound good together. People like Thome Yorke and Chris Martin try to get that philosophical with their lyrics. Noel doesn't. It isn't bad to do it the way Yorke and Martin do. It's just not the way Noel does it . . .
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Post by henrod89 on Aug 19, 2008 3:41:06 GMT -5
You want a brilliant lyric from Falling Down? I tried to speak to God, to no avail... ...I said if you won't save me, please don't waste my time I totally agree. That's a much better line. Especially since 'We live a dying dream' is followed by a really mediocre and lazy line like, 'If you know what I mean' . . .
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Post by Moorish on Aug 19, 2008 3:57:54 GMT -5
I'm not talking about Coldplay. You can't seem to fucking stop. A cliche is a cliche is a cliche, regardless of who it's written by. I'm not having a pop at Noel - I'm just saying that perhaps you're dressing his lyrics up as something that they're not. Well it seems like most people glossed over the "dying dream" line, whether they admit it or not.....so before people start accusing Falling Down of having shit lyrics - and I've seen a few people already have done so - I think they better understand the meaning of the lines before jumping to any sort of conclusion. Clearly if you understood that line, you'll realize it's not bad No.... understand YOUR INTERPRETATION of the lines. You have no idea what Noel "meant". You are guessing and making your own inferences. That's fine in and of itself, that's what people do with songs, they mean something different to everyone, but don't tell other people that they don't "get it" because your interpretation is, at the end of the day, just that - YOURS. I like the lyrics to Falling Down a lot. There's some great lines in there, along with some hoary old standards ("blows my mind" again, does it?), but overall the lyrics I think are very good. But don't dream up (no pun intended) your interpretation and ascribe it to Noel as his intent.
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