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Post by DixonHill on Jun 26, 2005 17:42:44 GMT -5
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Post by nyr401994 on Jun 26, 2005 20:56:05 GMT -5
or what i like to call "happy camps"
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Post by Kamikazi on Jun 26, 2005 21:14:59 GMT -5
That's among one of the most depressing pictures I've ever seen
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Post by Currian on Jun 27, 2005 13:12:50 GMT -5
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Post by lionsden® on Jun 27, 2005 18:06:25 GMT -5
It's nothing compared to what I've heard what's happening there... You'd rather have these nutjobs on the loose? People need to pay more attention to whos in there The worst of the worst
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Post by webm@ster on Jun 27, 2005 18:08:02 GMT -5
It's nothing compared to what I've heard what's happening there... source ?
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Post by Mario on Jun 28, 2005 16:14:26 GMT -5
Man thats sad, why cant we (americans) be more open minded and respect religion, and realize who the people to blame are. You cannot blame a religion! Id like for someone to read the Holy KOran and find something in it that desserves the book to be desecrated. Its alot like the Bible.
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Post by albertzz on Jun 28, 2005 16:34:11 GMT -5
It's nothing compared to what I've heard what's happening there... You'd rather have these nutjobs on the loose? People need to pay more attention to whos in there The worst of the worst How do you know they're nutjobs? The 600 who have been released weren't. It's an absolute disgrace and violation of America's alleged principles and reputation at home and abroad.
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Post by Currian on Jun 29, 2005 10:09:12 GMT -5
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Post by webm@ster on Jun 29, 2005 11:15:22 GMT -5
You'd rather have these nutjobs on the loose? People need to pay more attention to whos in there The worst of the worst No ofcourse not! But I've heard some are just innocent muslims, nothing to do with terrorism. And ofcourse nutjobs should be locked away but it's still horrible man. A dutch tv-station made a documentary, and it was terrible, they locked this guy up in a cell with stroboscopic light (you know the one that keeps flashing) and they had set this headphone on his ears with the music turned fucking loud and he's been there for 24 hours. And they also let 'em stand naked in the fucking cold. It sounds like the dutch documentary was a reenactment based on reports since the US army or any other army would never allow the filming of psychological war fare ? By the way I believe the music they were played was Metallica ( the band wasn't too happy to hear that )
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Post by lionsden® on Jun 29, 2005 11:28:28 GMT -5
You'd rather have these nutjobs on the loose? People need to pay more attention to whos in there The worst of the worst How do you know they're nutjobs? The 600 who have been released weren't. It's an absolute disgrace and violation of America's alleged principles and reputation at home and abroad. um...If I remember correclty many of the detainees that were let go joined the insurgents in Iraq. Give me a bit to find that info
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Post by albertzz on Jun 29, 2005 11:33:47 GMT -5
How do you know they're nutjobs? The 600 who have been released weren't. It's an absolute disgrace and violation of America's alleged principles and reputation at home and abroad. um...If I remember correclty many of the detainees that were let go joined the insurgents in Iraq. Give me a bit to find that info um, why don't we try something called logic. Ok, I'll go first. You cannot lock people up on the basis that they are guilty without having a trial first to determine whether or not they actually are guilty. Further, the fact that someone LATER ON did something bad does NOT mean they did something bad in the first place. Hell if you fucking locked me up in gulag/concentration camp conditions for years whilst destroying my holy book and not having charged me, let alone convicted me of anything, I'd be highly highly tempted to get in a plane myself. THe fact is America fights against torture and for liberty the world around. They show themselves as complete hypocrites through shit like this.
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Post by lionsden® on Jun 29, 2005 11:45:59 GMT -5
um...If I remember correclty many of the detainees that were let go joined the insurgents in Iraq. Give me a bit to find that info um, why don't we try something called logic. Ok, I'll go first. You cannot lock people up on the basis that they are guilty without having a trial first to determine whether or not they actually are guilty. Further, the fact that someone LATER ON did something bad does NOT mean they did something bad in the first place. Hell if you fucking locked me up in gulag/concentration camp conditions for years whilst destroying my holy book and not having charged me, let alone convicted me of anything, I'd be highly highly tempted to get in a plane myself. THe fact is America fights against torture and for liberty the world around. They show themselves as complete hypocrites through shit like this. Yeah they did. Most were taliban picked up in Afghanistan. Were the taliban not protecting bin laden? One of the masterminds behind 9/11. That killed 2,000+ AMERICANS!. We're just supposed to sit back and do nothing about it? What the hell do they deserve a damn trial for? I don't know if you are muslim ot not, but if you are I hope you are not the kind that moves to America, only to desecrate our flag in public forums.
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Post by lionsden® on Jun 29, 2005 11:47:55 GMT -5
um...If I remember correclty many of the detainees that were let go joined the insurgents in Iraq. Give me a bit to find that info um, why don't we try something called logic. Ok, I'll go first. You cannot lock people up on the basis that they are guilty without having a trial first to determine whether or not they actually are guilty. Further, the fact that someone LATER ON did something bad does NOT mean they did something bad in the first place. Hell if you fucking locked me up in gulag/concentration camp conditions for years whilst destroying my holy book and not having charged me, let alone convicted me of anything, I'd be highly highly tempted to get in a plane myself. And I really hope you don't mean what I think you do in your last sentence You should be banned from here if so
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Post by albertzz on Jun 29, 2005 12:55:39 GMT -5
Go tell webby
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Post by albertzz on Jun 29, 2005 12:59:20 GMT -5
"Yeah they did."
And you know that how? In the absence of a trial you know that how?
"Most were taliban picked up in Afghanistan." So you have the same problem as Bush trying to differentiate between people in the Middle East.
"Were the taliban not protecting bin laden?" Right. And that means you get locked up. Last time I checked it didn't. Last time I checked Hitler's average soldiers were not locked up. But they went free after hostilities ended. Last time I checked hostilities against the Taliban ended years ago.
"We're just supposed to sit back and do nothing about it? " No, you attacked AFghanistan which made some sense. (though from a legal standpoint still invalid). Then of course you attacked the wrong country, probably due to elemental reasoning errors like your own.
"What the hell do they deserve a damn trial for?"" why does anyone deserve a trial.
You are a very poor representative of America
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Post by lionsden® on Jun 29, 2005 13:43:12 GMT -5
"Yeah they did." And you know that how? In the absence of a trial you know that how? "Most were taliban picked up in Afghanistan." So you have the same problem as Bush trying to differentiate between people in the Middle East. "Were the taliban not protecting bin laden?" Right. And that means you get locked up. Last time I checked it didn't. Last time I checked Hitler's average soldiers were not locked up. But they went free after hostilities ended. Last time I checked hostilities against the Taliban ended years ago. "We're just supposed to sit back and do nothing about it? " No, you attacked AFghanistan which made some sense. (though from a legal standpoint still invalid). Then of course you attacked the wrong country, probably due to elemental reasoning errors like your own. "What the hell do they deserve a damn trial for?"" why does anyone deserve a trial. You are a very poor representative of America . I still can't believe you said that about getting into a plane. I'm sure webby and other members that live in NYC think very highly of you after that comment You are a fucking joke. Not worth anymore of my time
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Post by albertzz on Jun 29, 2005 14:16:42 GMT -5
K, so I wouldn't actually b/c I'm not a crazy asshole (i only said I'd be tempted), but I would be pretty pissed off if I was locked up for 2 years for no reason without even having been charged or had a trial while my holy book was treated like shit. Understandably so. SIMILARLY, having had a plane crash into you doesn't justify locking people up without charge or trial. both reactions are wrong. guantanamo is wrong b/c, as I assume you can now see, they come from the same wrong, emotional revenge reaction. oh and you attacked my karma, how brave of you. See I thought that this section was supposed to be free of the other sections. If karma is linked then it clearly is not. I have always suffered under this poorly constructed "divide" between the forums just b/c people disagree with me.
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Post by albertzz on Jun 29, 2005 14:35:05 GMT -5
look, I said what I said. That's true. But I mean, I can't control feelings. You can control what you do GIVEN your feelings, and what you do need not be simply what you feel, but you can't control the feelings themselves.
I said that IF I had been locked up for 2 years without charge or trial and badly mistreated the entire time I would be TEMPTED as in I would FEEL like taking revenge.
Admittedly, this isn't cool so I wouldn't actually do it but that's how I would FEEL that's what I was saying.
Similarly, if I am accidentally hit by a baseball I would FEEL like hurting whoever hit me. This is just a REACTION I wouldn't have control over it. I would then NOT hit the kid, but I might still FEEL like it.
I used this example to showcase how emotional reactions should not be the determinants of what we then do. AS a result, personal outrage at 9/11 should not inform decisions. As in, don't lock people up without trial. Similarly don't fly planes into buildings all because you're angry.
You seem to have a lot of trouble with understanding people and logic. Please differentiate between feelings and considered judgements. Please differentiate between emotional reacitions and what is right and wrong. Please differentiate between Osama and the taliban and please differentiate between the supposition of guilt and guilt.
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Post by Mario on Jun 29, 2005 16:10:42 GMT -5
You'd rather have these nutjobs on the loose? People need to pay more attention to whos in there The worst of the worst No ofcourse not! But I've heard some are just innocent muslims, nothing to do with terrorism. And ofcourse nutjobs should be locked away but it's still horrible man. A dutch tv-station made a documentary, and it was terrible, they locked this guy up in a cell with stroboscopic light (you know the one that keeps flashing) and they had set this headphone on his ears with the music turned fucking loud and he's been there for 24 hours. And they also let 'em stand naked in the fucking cold. And Hakim I have read the koran and I respected it ofcourse, but this book is the main reason for some of those freakheads to get all fucked up and that's the reason why some guys hate it. Im glad you have knowledge on the KOran and respect it. But please recognize that The Koran is not the reason there are terrorists, they use Islam as an excuse if you think about it. Those guys are idiots, and dont represent Islam at all. The Koran does not support attacks like 9/11, no mattter how much those guys on Fox news translate the terrorists saying it does. THere is a lot of barrier that gets misconsepted when broadcasted on the news. Just REmember folks, history and news is written by the winning country! Please remember that. Thanks
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Post by nyr401994 on Jul 2, 2005 21:03:11 GMT -5
No ofcourse not! But I've heard some are just innocent muslims, nothing to do with terrorism. And ofcourse nutjobs should be locked away but it's still horrible man. A dutch tv-station made a documentary, and it was terrible, they locked this guy up in a cell with stroboscopic light (you know the one that keeps flashing) and they had set this headphone on his ears with the music turned fucking loud and he's been there for 24 hours. And they also let 'em stand naked in the fucking cold. And Hakim I have read the koran and I respected it ofcourse, but this book is the main reason for some of those freakheads to get all fucked up and that's the reason why some guys hate it. Im glad you have knowledge on the KOran and respect it. But please recognize that The Koran is not the reason there are terrorists, they use Islam as an excuse if you think about it. Those guys are idiots, and dont represent Islam at all. The Koran does not support attacks like 9/11, no mattter how much those guys on Fox news translate the terrorists saying it does. THere is a lot of barrier that gets misconsepted when broadcasted on the news. Just REmember folks, history and news is written by the winning country! Please remember that. Thanks well said, hakim. you make some very valid points there. we should not judge ANYBODY. jews, muslims, islams, hindi, blacks, whites, hispanics, asians, catholics, protestants, etc. if america is truly the home of the free, then why the hell is there intolerance? women were allowed to vote for only about 85 years, gays aren't allowed to marry, and slavery was big for a very long time. fdr sent back ships full of jews only to be exterminated by the nazis because of his anti-semitism, blacks weren't allowed to really vote (they had the rights, but people found ways to go around them, such as grandfather clauses, literacy tests and fees to vote) until 1964-1965. calling muslims and islams terrorists, calling for all of their heads because of only a small few is not only against what this country is "for", but it's inhumane. the only problem with the news is where you're getting the news from. for example, i watch the daily show since they're on cable, so they're not afraid to say what is going on in this country (and in the world). if you think i'm crazy for watching this over the 11 o'clock news, there was a study that showed that people who watch the daily show over the regular news are more informed about what's going on in the world.
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